Last night was awful. Long negative post. If you don't like it, don't read it.

[btgoss]

This post is going to be negative. There is no way to put it other than it is going to be negative, so if that bothers you please drop to the bottom now and leave a nasty comment. If you want to read what an old time fan thought about last night, if not, well that is what forums are for, ranting about things that make us mad.

Wow. Last night really was just awful. What an embarrassing way to honor our fallen racing legends. Nice. Makes you so proud.

The Chargers started the fun with a crash filled feature. What has happened to this division? There was less then 20 cars for this event. I know the economy, and time of year played into the terrible car count, but this is not good. I really can't find anything to say that might be considered positive. No one was hurt? That was the most positive part of that amateur display. Of course, if you look back over the other four features run last night, the Chargers drop to number 2 on the list of WTF?

At this point I would like to ask what happened to the victory lane celebration/shenanigans? I thought these had been cut down. Last night's Charger display was ridiculous; of course the track had no idea that things were going to get worse. So you can give them a pass on this one. It took about an hour to complete the Charger event, not great, but you could almost accept it.

Then the Late Models came out. I had originally thought of using the 'talent optional division' tag-line for the Chargers, but obviously it is much more appropriate for the Late Models.

When you start the night by saying "These mooks had trouble with the first 10 laps last week, couldn't drive straight if they ran down the wall, so we are going to give them MORE laps, this should let them calm down" you are asking for trouble. I mean I almost spit soda out of my nose when I heard that. It is like asking for a meteor to hit the track. And then the meteor landed. Wow, that was truly the worst display of driving I have ever seen. Topped off, by the "winner" pushing the former leader from the lead, then complaining when someone tried to do the same thing to him. WTF? Have you hit your head?

And this brings me to my most important complaint. The support divisions should not have less cars than the headliner. If they do, something is wrong.

What is wrong? I have no clue. I have to say I didn't get a feeling that there is strong leadership at the track right now. And by strong, I mean any. From the starter not seeming to be in control of the flow of the races, to the track crew looking like they had been told to bring knives to a gunfight, I got the feeling that there is no "leader." There seemed to be a fair amount of people "doing stuff", but it appeared to lack purpose. This was really obvious during the LM fiasco. As stated in other posts here on this forum, that race should have been called after the first 45 minutes, when only about 2 laps had been completed. But no one made this call. Other tracks have dealt with out of control support divisions by ending the race and sending them home. Why wasn't this done?

The figure eight race was actually not too bad. At least not worse then any of the other races. It was a bit long for a 15 car race, but during the long slow demise of this once great division, this is what we have come to expect. I think they need to completely rebuild this division, but I think that about most of the divisions at Riverhead, so that is nothing new.

Let's talk Modifieds. I love the modifieds. They are the perfect racing car. They are the most awesome cars to watch race. I collect modified stuff. Old magazines, posters, decals, model kits. I love modifieds.

I left halfway through this race because I couldn't stand to watch anymore. Honestly, the mods suffered from the fact that the earlier crap really ruined my night. However, we still saw some of the really bad behavior that is wrecking modified racing. Drawing a caution should be grounds for a year long suspension. Nothing wrecks the night like some dude drawing a caution. The rest of my complaints are the same old same old. No passing, overly aggressive bumping. Just a general lack of racing. Of course this relates, in my opinion, to the lack of strong leadership at the track right now. Perhaps with stronger leadership, these types of behavior would be stamped out.

So that is how I felt about the racing last night. At this point I am going to skip the tour race and go to Wall. I am not going to say that I won't go to the track again, I will. After having seen the old CJ coupe blast around the track, you can be certain I am going to be at Old Timer's Day. Seeing those old cars was pretty much the highlight of the night.

So those are my thoughts. I am sure many will disagree, and that is great, I love to hear what other people say. However if you're just going to call me names, save it. Forums are for discussion, name calling is for the school yard.

[RGeeProductions]

What happened to a time limit for races?
This would have corrected a bit last night.

[Jeff T]

Yes BT, you have brought up many good and valid points. I did not see the Charger race, but saw the carnage coming off the track. The Late Model race was a disaster, some of it by the drivers, more so by the track crew who did an unacceptable job in doing their duties. The Figure 8 race was actually very good. The best part of the show was watching Mujsce and Baxter battle. As for the Mods, not bad except for one person driving with his head not screwed on all the way. Great battle up front between the 11, 84 and 6.
Now, for this question...why are we running Sunday afternoon circus acts on Saturday nights? For two weeks in a row, especially last night, the enduro's come out, the crowd goes home. We need to keep the Enduro's on Sundays, and by the way, what genius scheduled an Enduro on the same night as an extra distance Modified race???

[CRog00]

Yeah, it's a joke. I don't go to the track to watch enduros and other crap like that. I go to watch the stock cars. Anyway Congrats to Chucky Steuer, it's great to see hime back in victory lane.

[LongIslandJam]

As any FYI, the past few years Enduros have been scheduled for Saturday Nights in July. This is to promote the division, as well as provide a Saturday night feature which many Enduro guys want. However, from a businessman perspective, with 60 or so Enduros in the back gate, why not have them? At least they get a car count, and put on a show. The past few weeks there's been crowds, thanks in part to the Enduros.

Everything I hear in just about every division from Modifieds to Super Pro Trucks, is the disadvantage of handicapping. Starting slower cars up front, and fast cars in the back, spells trouble. Usually this isn't so much a problem with a big car count. As the slower cars in heats usually fall to the rear, go into a consi, and automatically start in the back. Maybe it's time to rethink qualifying for the divisions, maybe time trials (which I'm not a big fan of) or making heats count, by where you finish is where you start (which will cause carnage as well).

[deathwishracin1]

Nice to know a simple post venting on a poor night of racing needs to turn into a bashing thread. I personally hate running on Saturday nights. We are treated like the circus acts we are called by some of our "fellow" race fans and drivers. We get stuck in the parking lot all night because there's no room. We are treated like an inconvenience by some Saturday night drivers and parts of the track crew. We get run last for obvious reasons (that doesn't bother me, but it does some others). We don't even get to change flat tires in the pits after the race if need be. By the time we get out there, some drivers are just so sick of being treated like **** all night that it turns into a wreck fest. The July enduro (8 cyl at least) is the most violent of the year. We get kicked right out to the parking lot to load up in the dark and in the sand and I haven't heard one complaint on this board about it, so why single us out? If the enduros are such a circus act, what do you call the demos and the bus races? If we have the same interest as you, but can't afford to "build a real race car" like you make it seem you think, why hate on us? We do not affect your night at all. We do not postpone your events one bit. And God forbid somebody in the enduros sees a Sat night race and decides they want to come back and watch next week or, even worse, wants to build a Sat night car like so many have done. Thanks J.A. for defending us. We are, after all, racers and race fans.

[richardpetey]

Unfortunately, the more money you pour into a division, the more it becomes a "train ride" with all the "locomotives" following each other on the "tracks"..............................:disgusted
As far as going to Wall Township Speedway, it's the same game, different place.........................:rolleyes:
The only division at any "paved" track that offers "quality entertainment" are the "entry level" classes......................................:appl ause:
Why? Because there is passing going on all around the track............................:cheers:
Speaking of not "going fast and costing too much money", you know I'm going to defend all my "enduro brothers/sisters" no matter where they call "home".........................................:help:
I have the "Uncle Petey" competitor's challenge, now I'll have to institute a "Fans Enduro" challenge.........................:D
I've said this seems like a million times, but some of the best drivers anywhere either drove enduros or are still part of the sport to this day..................;)
Any fan who thinks that enduros are a circus act can use one of my enduro/racecars for a day at any track of their choosing.................:cool:
The fan must pay all costs financially, emotionally and physically associated with the sport..........................:eek:
I guarantee you will come away from this experience with a new appreciation for the so called "circus acts"..............................:lol:
UNCLE PETEY.........................:wave: :wave: :wave: :wave: :wave:

[The Bullfather]

Enduros bring a good family crowd that can't make it on Sundays. I respect you guys because you love to race and it's bare bones. But, it was poorly planned. Too many divisions on one night. But what really got to me was last night was a tribute night, a memorial race. I felt it was disrespectful to run anything after it! Baldwin/Jarzombek/Evans should have had top billing and ended the night. I hope in the future they don't run an feature or circus act as we seem to call them, not enduros they are not a circus act. The same for the Ernie Memorial race, it should be last race run in his honor as should the 77 lap race.

[LongIslandJam]

I don't think it was intentional Pete, as we discussed. I think we all knew it was going to be a long night. Let's learn from last night, and move on for the future. I have faith in the staff of Riverhead and the drivers to get together and improve racing and the fan experience. Just remember, as they said, Rome wasn't built in a day.

[The Bullfather]

I mentioned it, because I want them to learn from it. I don't think any race or non-divisional type race should follow a memorial race in the future.

[W. J.]

I do not now, nor have I ever regarded enduros as anything but bare bones racers. Yep, there's a few Yahoo's who think differently that actually enter a race here and there, but having covered these guys and gals quite a bit over my years of writing, I have to tell you they are passionate about their sport, they know it isn't 'big league', and they seem to enjoy themselves more than any 'overchromed' other division I've ever covered. As a group, they are helpful to each other, forgiving of what happens on the track (hey, "that's racin' " seems to be their motto), and they know how to have fun, which is what I thought the other levels of racing were also about. BT Goss has written a great critique of many of the things that are wrong with racing, and if the "Enduro Mentality" were applied across the board, all the other divisions would have a much better time, week in and week out.
I'm glad Terry wrote what he did, he put the situation in good perspective of how things are, and maybe somehow awakened someone, somewhere, to the plight of the future of racing if that's how these potential drivers of the future are going ot be treated. Bottom line, if you don't like enduros, don't stay. They can be unimaginable catastrophes in the first 10-15 laps when there are a lot of cars, but they race, make no mistake about that, and they race well, with all their heart and soul.
As for the rest of what happened Saturday, I'm glad I stayed in the Poconos for the best steak dinner I've ever, and the opportunity to spend that time with my loving wife. See you all this week, let's hope for the best to return to racing.

[Rich Mergl]

Last nights race reminds me of why I no longer enjoy going to RIVERHEAD.
THEY TELL ALL THE FANS TO COME VISIT YOUR FAVORITE DRIVERS AFTER THE RACE. I LEFT AFTER THE MODIFIEDS RAN AT ABOUT 11:15. When did anyone get into the pits 12:30? My opinion is they're using the MOD SQUAD to hold attendance at the track. Let the folks watch the stock car races, then run the other events after. If the track empties out, you know who the fans came to see that night, and improve on what they want to really see.

[J.D.]

I have to agree, I think last night was very unprofessional. Its a shame, because the vintage coupes running were great, and I also think the Modified feature was great. there was some tremendous racing back in the pack, Jimmy Blewett and Donnie Lia coming through the field. The time it took to clean-up the wrecks in the earlier races took way to long. Also it seemed like the track was very dark last night. Some lights were out.
Also, too many guys bringing out the yellow. I can see it , if the car doesn't start, but when the yellow is thrown, the guy starts up and gets back in the field.
I think last night would be an embarrassment to people bringing new people to the races.
I have been going to Riverhead for almost forty years, because I love racing. I hope they can straighten these problems out.

[Hollywood]

The reason the enduros HAD to run last night is because EKRA had the track for Sunday.... I agree that this Saturday night may not have been the correct night to run the enduros, but if all the races ran with only a few cautions, we would all be praising the track and the officials... The officials want ONLY to put on a GREAT show every night... I know thats all Mike and Jim want to do... I speak with them every Saturday evening. Just because a couple of drivers lose their cool and cause more carnage while the track workers are trying to clean up is not the officials fault. Mike made the right call booting the two charger cars last night... If a little more of that went on you would get cleaner driving, less crying and less fighting in the pits. With that said, you are never going to get a perfect situation. Lighten up on the officials and the track workers, it's their SECOND job. Sometimes I miss owning a modified, but then all of a sudden I wake up and realize I don't. Come on Sundays, watch the Karting teams and families and see some amazing young people really drive. We wreck stuff too but it's usually because someone makes a mistake.... NOT because they can afford to wreck equipment.

[RGeeProductions]

Change of subject for one post:
Didn't CJ's coupe sound AWESOME!!!
Opening the car up, like it was, brought back great memories of big block racing and their DEEP throaty sound!!!
That coupe was super fast........

[btgoss]

First, I am glad this is mostly a good discussion. I never mentioned the Enduro's, as I didn't stay to see it, or the end of the Modified feature.

I personally like the Enduro's. I happen to think they are great for the track. I think most of the new people in the stands come to see either an Enduro or a Spectator race. So on those nights it's very important to put on a great show. Then hopefully they come back. This is racing promotion 101 as demonstrated by Islip Speedway, have something to draw in the noobs, and convert them to fans with solid, exciting racing. That didn't happen last night.

Also, my plan to go to Wall was more of a situational thing. August 4th Wall is having a special race with Ray Evernham and his drivers, all in support of the Leukemia and Lymphoma Society. Since I am a lymphoma survivor that would be a better way to see a race and support something important. I know they have many of the same problems there. If I want perfect racing I would go to Orange County. (joking)

[The Bullfather]

Charlie J car sounded awesome but Steady Eddie Flemke's old coupe was LOOOOOUUUUUUUUDDDDDDD!!!!!
I heard cars over at Waldbaum's had their alarms going off!!!

[modified_fan]

When one loves something and sees it all messed up, be it one's (or a loved one's) health, a relationship......or local short track racing......one just wants to do all that one can do and make things right.

btgoss summed up this past Saturday so well.

One could be too sensitive and view it as criticism. One SHOULD view it as a call for help.

Riverhead Raceway needs leadership and direction. Some good people are new in their responsibilities to run the racing. Hopefully the powers above them either supply leadership for them.....or......let some of the more talented people they have empowered exercise leadership, wisdom and good judgement.

[RickFigure8]

I watched the enduro race last night and even commented to who I was with how many people were still in the stands watching after midnight. There was lots. Lets put it this way, at midnight last night there were more fans in the stands than there was all night on saturday 2 months ago. As far as the enduro mentality, it's okay for a 300 to 500 dollar car, not one of the other divisions. I do consider it a race. Knowing the Webster's for many years and being there for the very first enduro I know what they all go through. I think the circus act reflection comes to play with the no caution, anything goes part of the race. Lets face it, when 10 cars have the backstretch all but blocked and everyone is zig-zagging through them all like it's 34th and 5th at 1pm it's rather amusing. Maybe the yellow should be thrown away for the other divisions too. Force the drivers to think a little. But then there's the safety issue. And they aren't 300 dollar cars. Not that I feel the enduros are safe. It's just rolling the dice. I wouldn't want to be in a dodge neon sitting sideways and have a honda run into the drivers door doing 40 to 50mph. The big problem is there is NO entry level oval racing division at Riverhead. Anyone priced a blunderbust car lately? Drivers might be entry level but the machinery sure isn't. Okay, last thing I'll get on here, how a few weeks ago everyone is going on how short the show is, how we ran the mods in daylight. How fans get there at 6pm and the show is over at 8:30. And now everyone is going on how there's too much, lol. I do agree the night of a special long distance modified race like this one it should be the last race, or next to last before the figure8's. The main support divisons should have all been running with them and that's it. Plenty of other nights to drop a division and add the enduro or something else. What really messed up last night was it was one of those nights where most divisons had multiple cautions, with large cleanups and hooked up cars. I saw someone mention the moon. It happens. Now I could get into the certain cars that start up front every week and always cause a wreck by lap three, or the ones who start up front every week and are last by lap five, but someone else can. I just know I sit and watch with Tommy and Kathy and each week I say to them, I give him three laps, and I'm usually close, lol. There's lots of slower cars who start up front and the faster cars have no problem working their way past them without causing the big pileup. It's a certain few, week after week after week. This should be looked in to. Okay, I did get into it some I guess. Maybe nobody will notice. After all in this weeks figure8 picks Fred put a huge number 8, and still everyone after him still put Tom Kraft 16, lol.

[RickFigure8]

Both the coupe and the Hennesey car sound and still run awesome. Definitely enjoyed the show they put on. I agree on the 2X. It was parked by us and that injected big block was loud. Plus it smelled different, lol. Oh how I'd love to see them all put on a short show like last night. The X3, J6, 15 and a few others that have been restored.

[Teds Race Tours]

They should have time trialed the old cars just for fun!!!!

[allhailunc]

Thanks, BT, for the post-here. All along I've thought according to some that I was the only negative poster here. :lol: Hopefully all concerened(management, track crew & competitors alike) take into consideration what you had to state. Short fields and wreckfests? Doesn't make sense to me. :angel:

[rabbid1]

I'm one of those Enduro guys who now races in a regular division. I stopped racing Enduros at first because I really didn't have the time anymore, or so I thought. But since I've gone back to it, I have to say that I enjoy it more than ever. There are some great drivers and some good racing going on. As far as weekly divisions go, for my money give me the Blunderbusts. Before I drove 'em, I was a fan of the division. In what other division can you see a driver go from the back and win?? As far as the Riverhead staff, Give 'Em a break. Sometimes s..t happens. They're not getting rich doing this and they're breaking their butts so we can race.

[Hollywood]

The 2x is owned by Phil Elliston and is 700 HP of fuel injected Methanol :cool:

[SuperShafts]

In reply to the comments of circus act and memorial race.....

You are kidding right!

Memorial race and being upset at what follows it? ?....

Now you can say what you want and be mad at me or whatever...

You want a memorial, get their cars they last used and parade them on the track.... while that is taking place, the announcer can give the details. Now you had your memorial and then when they're off the track, racing begins...as for added laps and all that......for what? So a certain number is displayed on the last lap? and to make who feel better? you? me? them?

The memorial should be those cars lead their own parade laps and park them so the fans can see and touch them if they so want to.. or bring them out to parade each and every event on that day..


AS per long ongoing problems with time being wasted.....if F-1 can have a time limit for a race and SCCA, so can any other racing event involving laps..or run the laps down when problems arrise

As for the complaints made by some of the drivers as per room....

I absolutely agree, the room in the pits is so not set up right and kicking them to the un-lit lot, makes you wonder...

[Bobby Pease]

Ok.. from what I see here, some people did not like the way the show was run on Sat night.. OK, no prob. Some liked it, but thought it was a circus act! Some also thought it was disrespectful to the mods? OK, all of this said, what would you like to have happen now? It's over.. Please be careful what is wished for. When things are run perfectly here, be sure to comment on it. With all the things going on in the world right now, and all the worries that exist, this night at the race track is really not that terrible. BUT, at least this didn't turn into a BASH fest and basically stayed a discussion.. Stay safe!
Bobby Pease :cheers:

[W. J.]

Let's get some perspective here on how this all went. The Enduros get scheduled on Saturday nights in July to give them exposure to Saturday night fans who may not think it's worth theri time to see them on at a Sunday show, and to let the Enduro Divisions also showcase their talents in front of a different crowd.
As someone stated earlier, had all the scheduled divisions run a little more smoothly, it would have been a shorter, crisper show. That didn't happen, as it sometimes does, and it turned into a situation where everything could and did go wrong. While there is a time limit formula in effect at Riverhead, I know the officials are less likely to invoke it in the case of extra distance/double point races, except in very extreme circumstances. I wasn't there, so I can't judge if that was the case.
It's a shame when a show goes as this one did, running way past the time allotted to run it, but like Bobby said, it's over, let's move on to the next one.

One more note. Some say running time trials would make the show run smoother because the driver's they claim cause all the early wrecks would not then be a problem. Before you go any further, check out some of the qualifying runs those drivers have had, which still have put them up front. What needs to happen is that ALL drivers need to remember that no race is won in the first 5 laps, and to drive a little smarter, to not only prevent wrecks like we've seen, but to prevent extra costs to themselves and others. Better to finish last with a whole race car, than to finish 6th or better with a bent one. There really isn't that much money for 1st place to make it worthwhile to drive like a fool.

[rabbid1]

From a fans point of view, Time trials are a bit boring.

[nitros77]

You all complain about this, that, and the other thing, but think about it: Will it all matter in the end when there is no track to run at on
Long Island? Let's be thankful that it's here now. GOD ONLY KNOWS HOW LONG IT WILL BE HERE $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$
$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ $$$$$$$$$$$
$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ $$$$$$$$$$$
$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$,,,,,,,,,,,,,, PS WHEN YOUR HOME WATCHING A MOVIE AND EATING POP CORN YOUR GONNA WISH YOU WERE AT RIVERHEAD TILL 11:30

[Ace]

I agree SAL. Let's all be thankful we have a track to race!

The officials, Bob F., and Barbarba and Jim have been making changes and LISTENING to us here on the Jam.

Chargers need more races, we got a race added to the schedule.

Racing should start later, features now start at 6.

Spectator drags got added every week.

Late Models get an extra 5 laps.

Unfortunately, this past week was a wreckfest and with the tow trucks having their problems with the 2 separate wrecks, the night was a long one for sure.

For the heats, either qualify less or start the feature where you finish in the heat. This would eliminate the slower cars starting up front.
JMO

[W. J.]

For the heats, either qualify less or start the feature where you finish in the heat. This would eliminate the slower cars starting up front.
JMO
Just one thing here. Riverhead has a rule which says any feature winners in a given sesaon shouldn't be placed in the first four starting positions. Now, I don't disagree with that, but maybe what you want to push for is this: If only 16 cars show up in a division, take only the top 3 or 4 from heats, treat the rest like they ran the consi, and start them towards the back. That will provide an incentive to those whose cars aren't capable of running up front to either improve the car, or get used to looking at the rear bumpers of a lot of others. As for the better cars, even if they finish out of the running, they are capable of getting to the front by racing and passing, so where they start should not be a problem.

[fsracer]

I thought I would throw in my two cents and see who has comments.

On the track crew taking a long time to clean up the wrecks:

They need to be careful not to further damage the cars. It would be real easy to drag them out, attached if necessary, with the big wrecker.

I do remember a night not too long ago when my car flipped and the crew was directed to just let it drop back on it's wheels. It came down with a big crash. Luckily it did not seem to do much and we got it going without losing a lap.(and yes, it was a modified)

On lining up the cars to start handicapped.

Passing is exciting for the crowd and the drivers. Starting the slower cars in the rear would be a real yawn. Why do they have the first 6 drivers from time trials pick for position?

An incident in the LM feature, which I researched by talking with drivers involved and watching the videos, allowed me to reach the following conclusion: The driver who was blamed for the wreck seemed to come up a bit, but was clearly struck in the RR bumper(side) by a car behind, which seemed to come down a bit. A little lifting and there would not have been a wreck. The car behind could see it coming, the car in front had no idea.
Also, if the car in front had such a bad rep, maybe a bit of care when passing should be observed?

It seems to me that all of the drivers on the track have have a right to be there, and just about all of them are good people if you take the time to get to know them. A little respect will go a long way.

As the classes go up the ladder, the expenses also go up. I do not think anyone is making a living racing at Riverhead, it just is not the reason they are there. (BTW, I ran my car on what the track paid. My goal was to have fun, which I did most of the time)

The risk the drivers take is there for all of them.
Which class poses the most danger to the driver? Seems to me the enduro.

Driving at a short track or how it should be done in an ideal situation:

Drive your line. If you repeatedly block the car behind and you get spun, I would not be upset at the car that was blocked.

If a car is tapping you coming out of the corner or pushing you down the straight, it is clearly faster. When their front wheel gets by your door, you need to give them some room. Putting them in the dirt or in the fence is just inviting trouble.

A car intentionally hitting another car entering the corner should be put to the rear. Anybody can use the car ahead as a brake and it does not mean the car behind is faster.

I polled a few drivers and came up with some ideas.

How about putting the start of the race in the hands of the leader of the race? Let the lead car start somewhere between the apex of 3 and 4 and the current start line?
Understanding that the lead car must maintain a steady, reasonable,(Chuck? Nice job with the win, you worked within the current rules and did what you had to do. I do know of at least one car that burned up the clutch. . .) speed until the start. I feel the leader should get an advantage, they are starting first.

The green will be thrown and the race starts when the lead car jumps or the cars reach the current starting point. A second place car that moves ahead of or drops back further than the rear wheel of the leader will be result in a lazy green, a warning, and second restart. A second infraction sends the car to the rear. Cars should not move out of line until the green is thrown. Passing on the outside only until the cars cross the starting point.

Also, any car "jacking up" the car ahead on the start should be sent to the rear. Let's have some space and respect for the car ahead.

How about a rolled black flag (like is done in the karts)and an official's announcement to the starter for rough riding or blocking, followed by the black flag and suspension of scoring, and an official's yellow if necessary, to remove the driver in need of training if it keeps up.
Think this one over carefully, it would have to be applied to all, as a judgement call by the officials.

General stuff:
Careless driving during a caution-Immediate suspension from that race and the next one. Some one is going to get hurt or worse if this continues.

(My idea was to give Smoky a 12 gauge to shoot out the right front of the offenders. No one jumped on that idea.)

Contact (read crashing) another car after the caution or race end-see above.
Let the officials do their job.

Replay cameras for the officials (ouch, this is a hard one to do, but could settle many disputes.)

Put a car that was intentionally spun back in it's spot, and the offender to the rear. Additionally, if the spun car gets damaged, both cars go to the pits. The offender can not come back on until the spun car does. (I heard from drivers that this is done at some tracks) Putting both together at the back is asking for trouble.

Official's yellow to give out penalties when necessary. This may allow problems to be corrected and not spoil the finish.

This was a bit long winded, but sharing my thoughts may result in some positive changes. The above are just ideas, but ones that may make our racing experiences more enjoyable.

My wish to all at the track: Try to remember that this racing stuff should be fun.
To the drivers: Drive hard, respect the other drivers, and finish the night safely.

See you all at the track Saturday. (including Eric I hope)
Frank Saladino

[RGeeProductions]

Extremely well written and thought out Frank.
I give ya an A+ for homework this week!!!!

[Tower Man]

Yes Frank, very well written and factual.

What I have seen this year is lack of respect amongst the competitors. Why? They are not held accountable for their actions. Rough riding was never tolerated. Now, it's the norm. Deliberately hitting another car after the checkered happens all too frequently, again with no repercussions.

If everyone worked together, instead of against one and other, it would be so much better. And as Frank put it, fun.

[W. J.]

Frank, that is so to the point. Let's see when/if it will be implimented. :applause: :applause: :applause:

[btgoss]

I agree, well said Frank. But who is going to enforce it?

I am really getting the feeling that many people do not have confidence in the current people running the show at Riverhead. I think we need someone to step in, who has so many credentials, and automatic respect, that they would be able to get these problems straightened out. Including throwing out the bad apples. This the most important step, you get rid of the trash, the good guys feel good, and those on the fence come back to the good side. However, since I do not currently have the money to buy the track and set my plans into place, it is going to remain forum fodder.

[luvmods]

Frank,
Wow, a VERY thought out and well-written message regarding many of the "complained about" problems. I agree with everything you stated. We can only hope that the Cromarty's and other officials seriously take your suggestions to the table for discussion and implement all, or if not most, of them immediately. I think they need to address right away the slower cars blocking, intentional dumping, stopping on the track because you're pissed off (should be set to the back), and FIGHTING! These problems continue because no one wants to be the "bad guy" and offend someone. It's time that the offending driver(s) is (are) reprimanded or set down a night, and if necessary, suspended for the rest of the season, then maybe the others wouldn't be so fast to act "stupid."

I really think that our Co-Chief Stewards, Mike and Jim, are doing a great job in trying to resolve problems that have gone on soooooo long and had gotten soooooo out of control. They are more than willing to listen to the drivers and yes, even crew members, about problems/issues that arise. Suggestions are not taken lightly or ignored. I know that I have spoken to both of them on several occasions with great resolution. Hey Frank, we have even spoken about several issues some of which were in your post.

So everybody, let's all give them a chance. They've got so many problems that need addressed and fixed. As the old saying goes "Rome wasn't built in a day." And let's remember, Racing is Supposed to be Fun!

[SuperShafts]

Well since btgoss brought it up....what is the asking price of the track and how much further does the property of the track run in the back?

Where the tree line starts and the road goes to the right...how much further back does it go?

What stipulations are in place from our wondeful over controlling over involved govt?

[racerwife]

SuperShafts,
Instead of a lot of speculation on the selling price of the racetrack... contact the Cromartys' directly. They would or their office staff would certainly put you in contact with whomever is handling inquiries on the potential sale of it.
Rumors abound about a lot of things... I've heard that the property is everything cleared belongs to the track... I've also heard the track, all the fenced in areas and a perimeter of approx. 10' outside the fenced area are for sale, everything else belongs to LIPA.
Who knows for sure, except those that own it... call them if you are serious. The #842-RACE (7223)
I hope you are seriously interested. It would be nice to keep the track as a race venue...

[W. J.]

Once again, this thought has to go with all this speculation. If anyone were to buy the track, 100%, they would have to apply for a race permit from the town. You might as well ask how much gold is on the property, because the only way it could continue as a racetrack is if the Cromarty's maintained a part interest in the property, since they hold the permit, and the town is not likely to issue a new one to a new (100%) owner.

Next question.

[SuperShafts]

So buying the track would involve having the cromartys stay on as a interested partner, that could be worked out... I figured the govt would make problems..

I'll call them and see, I would see about it if there was room to expand and the govt wouldn't get involved with every last little detail....though I think a revolt would be easier..

No sale as per the phone call

[Tower Man]

Fact: Eastern most boundry goes along fence, sorta, behind press box
Fact: Western most boundry is the driveway exit to Rt.58
Fact: LIPA owns land west of facility starting at the middle of the driveway
Fact: Property line ends at Rail road tracks
Fact: 26 acres

FYI...this information is available from the town and easily accessible

[SuperShafts]

Fact: Property line ends at Rail road tracks
Fact: 26 acres



I called there is no plan to sell.... Thanks for the info though

Though the property line going to the tracks is good, should be enough room for a strip...but again depending on the control freaks

[W. J.]

Barely enough room for a strip, unless you take the track out, unless you are talking about 1/8 of a mile.

Okay, let's get back to the subject. "Long negative post. If you don't...."

[btgoss]

We are going further off topic here but...

I believe I read somewhere, (Long Island Business website perhaps) the track only pays $35K in taxes a year.

This is not a great deal of money at all when you really think about it. So, the truth about the towns motive is money. If the track was something else, the tax on that land would go way up, so the town makes more money.

All of the complaints about noise and all the hassles the town makes for the track about building or improving the facility are really just a smoke screen for trying free the land so it can generate more tax income for the town.

Any plan to modernize the facility would have to include paying this "ransom" to the town. I would guess that would include a drag strip.

It's a shame you just can't go to the town and ask what is the tax number you need to leave us alone and let us build and improve as we see fit. But then that would be too transparent for modern politics.

[SuperShafts]

We are going further off topic here but...

I believe I read somewhere, (Long Island Business website perhaps) the track only pays $35K in taxes a year.

This is not a great deal of money at all when you really think about it. So, the truth about the towns motive is money. If the track was something else, the tax on that land would go way up, so the town makes more money.


That's 35k more than Tanger pays.....

Tracks also have an entertainment tax, shopping malls do not, so if something else was on the property, I doubt it would bring more money, especially a non entertainment venue

I also think, now I do not know as per fact, but I find it hard to believe that L.I.B. got that right...unless they're speaking of property tax only, or entertainment tax only.

[W. J.]

If we continue to go off topic, this thread WILL close!

In addition, off topic posts will be deleted from it.

The topic, in case any have forgotten, is: Last night was awful. Long negative post. If you don't like it, don't read it.

[LongIslandJam]

Well, I think we all have decided that there's no more to be said about this topic.

Saturday was a bad night, but we'll move forward and learn from it.

Here's to tomorrow, a new beginning and I'm sure a better night for all.