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critter
10-25-2009, 05:42 PM
man ,joel glad your ok , that was right in front of me when u did that , dont do that again , just glad your safe , so if u need a hand tryin to make it straight for the mutha let me know

ThePill
10-25-2009, 05:46 PM
Thanks Critter and to everyone who asked how I was. I haven't even looked over the car but I'm told the frame is twisted. If anything comes from this I hope more guys realize that a good roll cage is needed. Without what I have I'd probably be waiting at LVH for test results. Like they say better safe than sorry. As for the Mutha, I will be there, but who knows if I can get a car ready by then.

critter
10-25-2009, 06:06 PM
joel let dx know what u need we can try to get u back out one last time with the bus , we have some tools lol

Poppop
10-25-2009, 06:48 PM
Watch out for your Dad Joel, he said you were going to get big lug nuts but didn't get around to it. He said he aught to kick your butt.:lol:

DerbyN8-128
10-25-2009, 07:34 PM
How many times did you roll? I only say the very end of the crash

critter
10-25-2009, 07:38 PM
i think i counted 4 times , crazy , just glad joel is ok , nte and joel rooll over club comin soon and i dont wanna join that one , just tryin to make u laugh guys :lol:

DerbyN8-128
10-25-2009, 07:41 PM
Yeah someone near us in the stands said at least 3...guess that would knock me out of the lead for most consecutive rolls :lol::lol::lol::lol:

Id say this is probably a club you don't want to be part of.

Danger83Ranger
10-25-2009, 07:42 PM
glad your ok. we caught the end of it from the stand but did not see how it started. im going to rethink for a better rollcage for next season.

EnduroFromDE
10-25-2009, 07:48 PM
I got up on my right side when my RR wheel came off, I thought I was going over, from inside the car it seemed that way. The dude with with me said it didnt look that bad...good thing that camera wouldnt of last...

ThePill
10-25-2009, 08:04 PM
Not sure if it was 3,4, or 5 times. I think Gary Silverman may have gotten it on film so hopefully he will post it online if he did.

punchy
10-25-2009, 08:08 PM
Thanks to all the concerned people for my brother. Its nice to know everyone sticks together in a crazy accident like that. I will check on him tomorrow sometime see if he needs tylenol..:lol: Well now he's officially a real race car driver, so they say on a Saturday night on the hill. We'll see if he gets his car ready for Nov.

mcstockcar
10-25-2009, 08:42 PM
I beleive you rolled 3 times? It happened within a few feet in font of me. I saw that tire wobble just before it came off. It was like slow motion from my veiw. I couldnt hit the brakes any faster! I was hopin no one drilled me into your car. Im glad to have seen you walk away. I AM now putting a cage in my car after seeing that. I wish i had a camera inside my car. It would make a good you tube video! I had front row seats! :)

DerbyN8-128
10-25-2009, 08:48 PM
I AM now putting a cage in my car after seeing that.

Glad to hear that. I am working on a collection of pictures showing what cages can do for driver's in this type of racing. I unfortunately didn't get a chance to get any pictures of Joel's car after the wreck, but have the ones of my car from earlier this year, and also from the 57 car today after the ladies race crash. The cage in that car was actually bent, bad. Without a cage in her car (including door bars) ...the damage would have been substantially worse in my opinion.

Ive said it before and I'll say it again...this can happen to ANY car our there on the track...everyone should consider that, and think about installing some form of cage.

mcstockcar
10-25-2009, 08:55 PM
I didnt get to see the Ladies race. There was a bad wreck??? All OK?

punchy
10-25-2009, 08:57 PM
Nate I took pictures of Joels car if you want I can get you copies or email them to you. Let me know! Wouldnt you think cages would be mandetory? Why arent they?

critter
10-25-2009, 08:57 PM
yeah all the ladies where fine , both 39 cars and 57 hooked up in the turn ,on a good note the 00 took 3rd woohoo go punchy , im also thinkin i should add a few more bars

DerbyN8-128
10-25-2009, 08:59 PM
I actually did not see the wreck either, but heard it from the pits...it was LOUD.

From what I have heard the two 39 (big and small car) were involved as well as the 57. The small 39 car t boned the 57 in the passenger side and pushed the whole side of the car in. The small car also started on fire as a result but quickly extinguished.

Tracy, driver of the 57 was alright. She seemed rather shaken up in the pits afterwards though. It was a really hard hit she took..and the amount of damage the small car did to the big car shows that.

mcstockcar
10-25-2009, 09:00 PM
BD is going mandatory next year for full cages. I see why. WOW! I m glad all are ok in the ladies race.

DerbyN8-128
10-25-2009, 09:12 PM
Nate I took pictures of Joels car if you want I can get you copies or email them to you. Let me know! Wouldnt you think cages would be mandetory? Why arent they?

That would be great...you can send them to Heffner128@comcast.net
No rush, when ever you get a chance.

After my roll over earlier this season I wondered the same thing about why they are not mandatory. I have heard a few reasons why they aren't, not just in this series but enduros across the country, and I do not particularly agree with them (such as trying to keep racing cheap as possible).

There are a lot of cars out on the track without cages. Luckily for NEETS, the cars that have rolled so far at grandview have had cages in them. It's only a matter of time before the luck runs out for an un-caged car...and someone gets seriously hurt. I feel that mandatory cages should be considered in the near future.

That's just my opinion. With the amount of damage my car got from the roll, I don't think I would have been walking away under my own power WITHOUT the roll bar being in there. I will NEVER climb in another race car without a full cage.

mcstockcar
10-25-2009, 09:13 PM
New Egypt even had a rollover my neighbor told me.No one got hurt. They had 30+ cars!

Buckshot11
10-25-2009, 09:45 PM
Riverhead has a regular division for roll over contest. They dont put cages in them because, 'It hurts to much'...so I've been told lol. I think some of these boys have hit their head too much.:confused: You wont catch me in that divions or a car with out a cage. You can have them installed for less then $500, weld your own for about $250 (kit) or bend and weld your own for less then $150. Its WELL worth it.:help:

BIGDADDY64
10-25-2009, 09:48 PM
i agree with having a rollcage 100 %
i rolled over at the pagoda last year and was glad i had roll bars in that car wont catch me without one

mcstockcar
10-25-2009, 09:50 PM
Your absolutly right! Materials are cheap. Can you put a price on saftey? S+W and other companies make bars pre bent for a lot of those cars on the track. Just put it in and weld it up.

richardpetey
10-25-2009, 10:23 PM
Thank God your OK and that it didn't happen on your birthday.........................................: eek:
UNCLE PETEY........................:wave: :wave: :wave: :wave: :wave:

gary243
10-25-2009, 10:55 PM
I caught the tail of it. Whatever I have will be in the highlights tomorrow.

NeetsSpectator
10-25-2009, 11:05 PM
I got the entire flip or should I say flips.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2GWl2XmE-G4

gutter7
10-26-2009, 06:34 AM
Roll cages are great but I still see belts not fastened right and guys wearing snow mobile helmets, so there is def. room for improvement.

CJfilms
10-26-2009, 06:42 AM
That was crazy! I'm with the rest of the crowd here....I was watching the crowd of cars coming dow nthe front stretch and just caught the last part of the roll......

We are all very happy that Joel is alright....pending Punchy's checkup today!

We are having our rules meeting on November 21st....although we cannot invite every driver, this is one topic that will be on everyone's tongue! Roll cages, if not a minimum number of properly placed bars, will become mandatory.....the rules are lax right now for this department, luckily the few cars that have suffered the hardest hits/flips have had full cages....

Now this goes for everyone.........Joel gets the gold prize here......no one try to top that! 3.5 times up and over is enough!

The history of the roll:
First there was Jack Zeilsdorf, starting things off slowly with a nice 1/2 roll, smoothly landing it on the side of the car...

Second, we have Nate Heffner, with a nasty little double flip in the small car race...

Third was Jon Sacks in the 412 Big Car with a roll very similar to Joel's roll when his wheel came off...

And now, FINALLY - NO MORE, Joel's roll with 3.5 and mostly in the air barrel roll!

CJfilms
10-26-2009, 06:45 AM
Also, from watching the clip here.......

The cage is not only the main factor here...I actually don't remember if Joel runs a fuel cell or not, but this video brings up another good point.

We are finding a lot of 'thrown together' fuel cells. They are not leaking, but there are either remants of gas that was spilled or a loose connection somewhere along the lines. IF you are running a cell, please make sure if is installed properly. You cannot duct tape the lines to prevent them from pulling out or leaking, they have to be done right. Joel's trunk took a nasty beating in this flip, if he had a cell that was improperly installed, this could have turned into a fireball flip.......

ThePill
10-26-2009, 07:43 AM
Nate if you want better pictures you can probably swing by and get pics at the garage. The car is sitting outside. From what I saw the cage bent down slightly on the front door area. Not bad though.

I do run a racing fuel cell. It is bracketed in and welded down real good. I'll have to check to see how that held up.

Awesome footage spectator. Send that to spike TV, LOL.


As for me, a little sore this morning but not as bad as I expected.

punchy
10-26-2009, 08:04 AM
Joe........ Joel has beat me to his update.........well he says he feels ok I guess, I watched the flip on the you tube clip. I missed the original flip due to walking back to the pits! Only saw him climbing out of the car. I feel bad for all those who were right behind him to watch all that and have to sit and wait and not be able to help. Good thing you guess know what the break is when you need to use it! :applause:

CJfilms
10-26-2009, 08:32 AM
Speaking of cars right behind him....

I think those drivers did a great job stopping immediately and blocking Joel from the rest of the traffic as well!

Even after a car flips, sometimes drivers will position themselves around the car so when the green drops, there is nothing in front of them... Tim Pauch, Jack Zeilsdorf and Critter stopped without going around Joel. This was exceptionally good since his roof was facing traffic! If they went around and someone else who didn't see the flip was still racing, they could have plowed right into the top of his car.....good job EVERYONE!

Extra round of applause to all the drivers who stopped quick for this Red Flag....being I am not the fastest to get the lights on and wave the red....you all did a great job!

tbirdracer
10-26-2009, 11:15 AM
i have flipped with a 4 point rollcage and full cage. i really feel better with full. my two cents is you must run at least a 4 point cage. just fit a roll bar from the back of a truck that is what my old car had in it when i flip my enduro car. it it up to each driver who races to think about themself. but i think the promoter should also think about the people who race for them. we all are glad the pill is ok and all drivers that flip here this year. but what would have happen if he did not have anything. that's me thinking out loud.

CJfilms
10-26-2009, 11:18 AM
but what would have happen if he did not have anything.

Ask Jon Sacks....he did not have a full cage, his roof caved in when he landed upside down....luckily though he did not have a 5-pt harness, therefore he was able to slide himself down to avoid any seious injury.

I am going to start a thread about this topic as well.....

critter
10-26-2009, 04:05 PM
glad to hear to here your ok joel , dont ever do that in front of me again ,or ill kick your a lol , i was feelin pretty bad to u got out , ill bring u some mt dew when i come get my car lol

DerbyN8-128
10-26-2009, 06:41 PM
Now this goes for everyone.........Joel gets the gold prize here......no one try to top that! 3.5 times up and over is enough!



I gotta be honest...I'm a little jealous that Joel did better than me...

What the heck is wrong with me lol :lol::lol::disgusted:lol::lol:



And now, FINALLY - NO MORE, Joel's roll with 3.5 and mostly in the air barrel roll!

So would I be breaking a rule if I went for a 360 spin into a front flip followed by a double cart-wheel and land on all 4 wheels? :help:

Erin C
10-26-2009, 07:01 PM
Yes you would, but "Enough is Enough" (inside joke)...Needless to say I think this will get a special mention at the banquet LOL

DerbyN8-128
10-26-2009, 09:29 PM
technically Joel won the combination part, 3 or 4 rolls compared to my two...but everyone knows that the routine is only half the score...the landing is the rest. I landed on all 4 wheels...Joel fell a little short :lol::lol:

CJfilms
10-26-2009, 09:37 PM
Ok....ok.....so we have to subtract .75 from his roll due to techniqhue....he still has three rolls, two of which were mid-air!

:lol:

mcstockcar
10-26-2009, 09:38 PM
I guess my 1/4 roll started the season!! So hopfully Joels will be the last one for the year, in that case, forever!

CJfilms
10-26-2009, 09:47 PM
So hopfully Joels will be the last one for the year, in that case, forever!

I second that!!!

ThePill
10-27-2009, 06:28 AM
Nate, you may have landed on your wheels but how hard is it to keep a heavy car from rolling back onto its wheel....

DerbyN8-128
10-27-2009, 03:43 PM
Nate, you may have landed on your wheels but how hard is it to keep a heavy car from rolling back onto its wheel....

Very true...I'm not going to win here am I?

:applause:

ThePill
10-27-2009, 03:53 PM
Let's just say you are the small car roll over champion!:applause:

Poppop
10-27-2009, 04:06 PM
:applause:You just had to make post #44 didn't you Joel?:applause:

NeetsSpectator
10-27-2009, 04:15 PM
Let's just say you are the small car roll over champion!:applause:

The season isn't over yet!

rockinrick120
10-27-2009, 04:44 PM
Having had one of ther hardest crashes this year(see pictures from 4/26/09 for car #120). If that had been the side of a car without a cage instead of the back someone could of gotten killed.Should be MANDATORY PERIOD,if you can't afford a cage you shouldn't be racing. Sounds mean but its not just you the racer,it is all the friends and family that would be affected by your death or serious injury.

DerbyN8-128
10-27-2009, 04:50 PM
The season isn't over yet!

exactly...there is still time for me to improve on mine :lol::lol:

Small car roll over champion works for me. :cheers:

ThePill
10-27-2009, 05:32 PM
Don't let your wife hear you say that

richardpetey
10-27-2009, 07:02 PM
This is getting bad! Now you guys are rehearsing your routines for the next aerial show......................:eek:
I saw the #412 do his flipper, in front of me, a couple of races ago....................:(
Man.......I don"t ever want to see the "unshiny" side again....................:help:
UNCLE PETEY..................:wave: :wave: :wave: :wave: :wave:

critter
10-27-2009, 07:13 PM
seen joels car up close today m its not comin back , but i told him if finds a car like now i will be there to help to get him in the mutha , com on joel find a car , just make shore u have mt dew for me :cheers:

CJfilms
10-27-2009, 09:41 PM
No more aerial stunts! Let's keep all 4 on the dirt!

Like Petey said....we don't want to see the unshiny sides again! :applause::applause::applause: