WMT 10 Team

[Rabbit504]

I heard the 10 Team is done also.

[chrome horn]

SPreading rumors again Ray? Spoke with Gary. Some of us go right to the source.

[Rabbit504]

So Flemkes NOT trying to get in a backup car for Bristol?

(and other races Francis)

[worm]

looks like they will be racing alot!

[chrome horn]

Looking for a ride because the cost is just too much and closing shop are two different things ray.

[chrome horn]

Seeing I'm on a computer now and not my phone let me be a little more clear on what Gary Teto texted. After Loudon losing the motor etc., He decided not to do Bristol and Canada because of the costs involved, just not in the budget. According to Gary " we HAVE NOT divorced, shut down or parted ways."

So Mr Skooglan, once again, speaking without all the facts. I'll start listening when I finally see that yellow and red troyer you were bragging about a couple of years ago. And just remember, my name is at the bottom at every post I put up here, not hiding behind a screen name.

[Rabbit504]

It seems to me someone has an issue.
I don't remember Ever saying to you anything about any yellow and red troyer.
In fact, I don't ever remember meeting you OR talking to you.
Am I wrong on that?

Was that a rumor someone told you?
Did you go right to the source on that one?
You are a hipacrite PERIOD!


I stand by what I was told by my source, Francis, as my Father use to say"it will all come out in the wash".

Now go ahead and delete this... you know you want to!

I'm done now.

[chrome horn]

Delete this why? cause you called me a hipacrite? I'm leaving it first of all because it's HYPOCRITE Second of all, I've been called worse by better people.

Should I delete it because you called me Francis? Proud of my name, after my grandfather.

And I didn't have to go to the source on the other issue, it came right to a mutual friends phone!

Bottom line Rabbit, I know a lot of stuff too. Stuff that could make people scratch their heads, but I don't run on here to look like a hero.

[Goldy]

Teams, drivers and arguments aside; whether its terminating relationships, suspending operations or taking these 2 upcoming races off – this all does raise a very apparent issue – the cost of racing on this tour is killing it. Other teams must be at crossroads with the approaching midweek race at Bristol (duhhhhh)… and the utterly absurd road trip to Canada looming…

It really is mind numbing to think how one, or in this case, (a sanctioning body who is supposed to operate and function for the best interests of its members) can schedule these overly expensive races when they fully know that (1) teams can’t afford it, (2) fans (and crews) will be stretched to support it and (3) an entire seasons payout and point fund don’t allow for anyone other than the top 1 or 2 teams to stay in the black..

.. yet they pile it on…

From a cost standpoint - seeing other teams skip these races should not surprise anyone..

Good luck to Edward in landing a ride..

[chrome horn]

Well said Goldy

[limodmaniac]

Nascar has to increase the point fund, and include more drivers in the point fund. There should be at least a million dollar point fund and the payout should be to the top 25-30 drivers.

Television coverage is a must. That the K and N series has all races televised and the modifieds have only two is sickening.

If something isn't done soon, I'm afraid the tour will be in big trouble next year.

[jaFor]

If something isn't done soon, I'm afraid the tour will be in big trouble next year.[/QUOTE]

It already is in BIG trouble! :mad:

[JMB]

Nascar has to increase the point fund, and include more drivers in the point fund. There should be at least a million dollar point fund and the payout should be to the top 25-30 drivers.

Television coverage is a must. That the K and N series has all races televised and the modifieds have only two is sickening.

If something isn't done soon, I'm afraid the tour will be in big trouble next year.

I don't think TV and the points fund would help. It probably needs more of an actual race payout.(what they really get vs. what is advertised is terrible for all the regional series) In the West Series when they send mostly LA based teams to Seattle, Denver, and Montana the car count drops way off due to the cost of a 2,000 plus mile round trip.

[CynthiaTork]

Remember the good old days with single day shows at Lee, Beech Ridge, Waterford and Oswego

[Mod Squad]

I have first-hand knowledge of a team that runs a modified weekly. The cost to operate and maintain a car in just one of the small tracks weekly divisions can be overwhelming. How the owners continue to operate week in and week out like they do absolutely amazes me. A big thanks to all involved who support the Modifieds.

With that being said, I think times are changing. Car counts are dropping at all the Modified tracks and on the big tours. This topic has been on this board and others for years. Tour purses and point funds have either dropped and/or stagnated to the point of being ridiculous. It's obvious these teams do it for their love of modified racing because NO ONE is making money doing it. I hate seeing the 36 Team and TC part ways but maybe it's a wake up call. If one of the best operations on the tour says "screw this, it's a lose, lose scenario I'm keeping my stuff at home" then maybe that's what's needed to wake Daytona up.

If Daytona wants the Tour to be a "Tour" then pay the teams accordingly for the time, and effort. Not many people can afford to give up time out of work these days. Mid week shows over 700mi from where you normally run is ridiculous. I know of one team that is leaving THIS upcoming Sunday for BMS. I'm sure there are others. Basically you have to take a week off in hopes that your car can finish in the top 10 to earn $1000. At some point people have to say enough is enough.

I'm in the military and I've been involved in Carrier Aviation for over 20 years, we are constantly getting budgets cut and are being told to do more with less. That works to a point when either someone gets killed or we lose airplanes. Obviously running on the modified tour isn't the same comparison. My point is it took senior enlisted leadership beating executive leadership about the head relentlessly for them to understand that you need proper logistics support to get the job done right. If the mod tour owners continue to support the series and travel to ridiculous locations, for insignificant purses without any help from Daytona. Then Daytona will keep sticking it to them just like the government is doing to the military. Do more with less. The main difference in this scenario between Tour owners and the Military as a comparison is the team owners have a choice. Don’t go. That’s what the Southern teams said about Thompson right? I hate saying it but why should these hard working teams continue to fund Daytona with license fees and all the other stupidity for no return. That’s my rant and JMHO sorry for taking everyone’s time and sorry if I got off topic. Good luck to TC and Flemke on getting a ride.

[Goldy]

Its times like these, (and I tend to get like this oh say 1.7 times a year) where this fan feels my Modified racing doesn’t have to:
Say NASCAR, be in excess of 100 laps, require pit stops, require licenses, be a “tour” or “series”, have outside driver intros, Time Trials…

.. but it should be:
Fun, exciting, affordable (for fans and owners) and provide options…

Now if you said – well Goldy, that’s your weekly CT based SK show or your NH, NY, LI weekly Mod race – I’d say – so be it..

What we have here is a broken Modified racing collective; where a premier sanctioning body takes advantage of its teams (complaining ensues, but nobody takes a stand), where an up and coming series looses sight of its mission and purpose, where local tracks fail year in and year out to make an abundance of cars and available nights of racing “work together”; and regrettably, where owner and driver egos tend to get in the way of doing the right thing.

Getting the required purses, it’s not happening; getting the big point fund payout – ahhh, no, that’s not happening either. Getting your sanctioning body to listen and do what’s in the best interest of the owners wallets – forget it.

In my view – a “dumb(ing) down” of this tour is the right direction. What I mean by that is - dissolve it. There, I said it.
Teams will scatter and we’ll all still get to see modified racing..

[BChat]

Nice post Mod Squad. I could be very wrong here, but my guess is that NASCAR could care less about the Mod Tour.

ETA - Goldy, got to agree with you - another good post.

[MJProcko]

As I have said before, having people buy a Nascar license to race weekly at all the short tracks across America and then to require them to purchase another one to race at the same track in the WMT is a losing proposition for everyone, Nascar included. Over the course of the WMT season you get around 45 cars to attempt a race. There are another 100+ modifieds out there you are cutting out of the market by the licensing costs alone. you get 25 to 30 0f those cars to attempt a race or two and not only have roughly covered the loss of those licenses, you have also opened up new markets for possible races. Granted the license money goes straight to daytona so telling them they are getting the money on the backend is hard for them to comprehend but isn't that the story they tell the car owners and tracks?

Look at what you had last week, the defending Nascar Whelen All American series champion, Keith Rocco, one of the hottest short track drivers in America, a guy Nascar touts as the "Soul of Nascar" in their TV commercial. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KJnY18929Y0 - He's out dusting another modified series at his home track but is watching on the sidelines when the WMT comes to town I'm sure in part because of the license costs.....

If that open Nascars eyes maybe this will.... Let's take the guy who, week in and week out is in the pits at Stafford, busting his ass all week long working on an SK light car because he loves the sport. He's one of the guys who keeps the track open and now you want to charge him another 250 bucks to go jack up a buddies car during pit stops in the WMT... thats just pure greed Nascar.

[JMB]

As I have said before, having people buy a Nascar license to race weekly at all the short tracks across America and then to require them to purchase another one to race at the same track in the WMT is a losing proposition for everyone, Nascar included. Over the course of the WMT season you get around 45 cars to attempt a race. There are another 100+ modifieds out there you are cutting out of the market by the licensing costs alone. you get 25 to 30 0f those cars to attempt a race or two and not only have roughly covered the loss of those licenses, you have also opened up new markets for possible races. Granted the license money goes straight to daytona so telling them they are getting the money on the backend is hard for them to comprehend but isn't that the story they tell the car owners and tracks?

Look at what you had last week, the defending Nascar Whelen All American series champion, Keith Rocco, one of the hottest short track drivers in America, a guy Nascar touts as the "Soul of Nascar" in their TV commercial. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KJnY18929Y0 - He's out dusting another modified series at his home track but is watching on the sidelines when the WMT comes to town I'm sure in part because of the license costs.....

If that open Nascars eyes maybe this will.... Let's take the guy who, week in and week out is in the pits at Stafford, busting his ass all week long working on an SK light car because he loves the sport. He's one of the guys who keeps the track open and now you want to charge him another 250 bucks to go jack up a buddies car during pit stops in the WMT... thats just pure greed Nascar.

I remember for the first few years of the Busch North Series, the Oxford weekly cars could run the races(a couple other tracks did this once or twice) I believe without a license. They just would not get points for the race. That probably also extended back to when the old NASCAR North tour ran there too. I am guessing this was probably also the case for the first couple of years with the NASCAR Modified Tour when some tracks still had weekly Mods.

[RacnJason00]

Remember the good old days with single day shows at Lee, Beech Ridge, Waterford and Oswego


HELL YAHHHHH :applause::applause::applause::applause::applause: :applause:

[Speedy]

Its times like these, (and I tend to get like this oh say 1.7 times a year) where this fan feels my Modified racing doesn’t have to:
Say NASCAR, be in excess of 100 laps, require pit stops, require licenses, be a “tour” or “series”, have outside driver intros, Time Trials…

.. but it should be:
Fun, exciting, affordable (for fans and owners) and provide options…




....sounds a lot, (but not exactly like) the thriving Valenti MRS - Speedy

[MOD11RACER]

You people just don't get it.

Read between the lines. It has nothing to do with money. The cost of traveling to Bristol and Canada is just an excuse to get rid of TC. This has been the talk all year. All TC does is blame everybody else when he can't win. He just drives the thing. Some people never know when they have a good thing going. Did everybody forget TC wanted Brad removed as crew chief last year and got his wish. Did TC run any better without Brad ? I don't think so.

NASCAR and the WMT doesn't pay enough money we all know that. The MRS pays a purse of $14,215 per event thats why the WMT isn't racing at Seekonk, Waterford, Lee and Beech Ridge. Come on people wake up and smell the roses. The MRS pays so little it screws all of the Modified race teams.

I hope someone on this thread who wants the WMT dead has a plan and about $300,000 to pay a point fund to replace what the teams now get. If you get rid of WMT you better have a replacement for it. Like it or not it's the only game in town. The MRS and the ROC pay the champion only $5,000 to win the title. 15th on the WMT pays more than that. If you think the teams on the WMT are going to go out and run one of those Tours your crazy. If the WMT dies so do the Modifieds.

Look for someone who gets along really well with Brad to be in the red 36.

[Goldy]

I hope someone on this thread who wants the WMT dead has a plan and about $300,000 to pay a point fund to replace what the teams now get. If you get rid of WMT you better have a replacement for it. Like it or not it's the only game in town. The MRS and the ROC pay the champion only $5,000 to win the title. 15th on the WMT pays more than that. If you think the teams on the WMT are going to go out and run one of those Tours your crazy. If the WMT dies so do the Modifieds.

It's all relitive isn't it? If I don't need over 100k on the season to run the tour, I don't need the large purses and the large point fund.. Without the WMT, Modified racing will not die..

[MXCHAMP04]

You people just don't get it.

Read between the lines. It has nothing to do with money. The cost of traveling to Bristol and Canada is just an excuse to get rid of TC. This has been the talk all year. All TC does is blame everybody else when he can't win. He just drives the thing. Some people never know when they have a good thing going. Did everybody forget TC wanted Brad removed as crew chief last year and got his wish. Did TC run any better without Brad ? I don't think so.

NASCAR and the WMT doesn't pay enough money we all know that. The MRS pays a purse of $14,215 per event thats why the WMT isn't racing at Seekonk, Waterford, Lee and Beech Ridge. Come on people wake up and smell the roses. The MRS pays so little it screws all of the Modified race teams.

I hope someone on this thread who wants the WMT dead has a plan and about $300,000 to pay a point fund to replace what the teams now get. If you get rid of WMT you better have a replacement for it. Like it or not it's the only game in town. The MRS and the ROC pay the champion only $5,000 to win the title. 15th on the WMT pays more than that. If you think the teams on the WMT are going to go out and run one of those Tours your crazy. If the WMT dies so do the Modifieds.

Look for someone who gets along really well with Brad to be in the red 36.Money may not be the cause for the 36 team not going to Bristol, but for some it will. And you're dead wrong. If the WMT dies then modified racing will not die. It will become stronger as those guys who wanna race will go race in other series.
I think you have to have just a love to race mods. I thought of buying a mod a couple years ago when I retired from racing motocross. I can afford it but said I have to be nuts. The costs compared to the payout is ridiculous. i figure you have to finish fifth or so or better to break even, and forget it if you wreck or blow crap up, then it gets expensive real fast.
When i was racing motocross in the mid to late 90's until 2007, you could easily make money racing. Each class was 35 dollars to enter and gas for travel, and the bike, that was it. At most 150 bucks a day. In the expert class you could easily make 300-400 per class for a win and contingency money from the manufacturer ( yamaha, honda, kawasaki, and suzuki) of 500 for a win down to 100 for fifth. If you raced three classes a day you could easily take home 1,000-2,000 a day. Hell the manufacturers were paying contingency to the amateur classes and vet classes of 100-300 for a win per class. In the end my buddies and I weren't even running for championships any more. We were just going to different racing series based on who was paying contingency just to make money. Sorry for the rant, but the cost of running a mod just doesn't add up, I would love to try it as racing is in me, but forget it, i'm not gonna go broke doing it.

[Goldy]

MXCHAMP04 - you're on the right track... and others, lets not confuse the issues at hand here with the 36 and the 10.. different situations but the cost of running these next 2 races are a factor...

.. btw - where is my pal GLC050 on this matter - Bob always had a good view on this whole disscussion..

[M T Pockets]

Shame on you Buggs for trying to stir trouble and post misleading information. I am just a phone call away if you wanted to know something but then again you wouldn't have been able to sensationalize on the truth. I'll give you a little more than what was in a previous post. On a personal note I was out of work and out of commission for six weeks due to health issues and just starting to get back slowly. During that time our race team performed 110% and did everything any car owner could ask for in his or her absence. The pain of missing races especially the first NH race was worse than the physical pain I had. What you don't know is the the relationship I have with people that drive my race cars. Show me just one driver that would give up their seat in a car for another driver. Well Tony did that so Edward would have a ride but more so because he believed it was in my best interest and yes he calls me every week. Edward and I have been friends for twenty years and so there is a bond that is way more important than any owner/driver arrangement could have. We have no secrets. When I wanted to try to run two cars at a couple of races he was the first person I told because someone like you would have loved to twist the truth and fabricate a story. While I take what you say as worthless I'm writing this because what was said affects a lot of people, fans, sponsors, crew, family and friends.

As was stated we suffered a motor loss and more at NH last week, that combined with business conditions and the cost involved to just travel to Bristol and Canada I don't have the necessary funding to compete in these races unless I want to forget about the races that follow them. Now, if you would like to sponsor us for these races I'll be happy to make a change in plans as my entry has already been sent in. With this understanding I suggested to Edward to try to make other arrangements for these races. Yes, he has talked to the Hills and they are in the process of working things out. You SEE Bugg's not behind my back but with full knowledge so people like you who do what you do just keep loosing credibility.

If you spent as much time doing something constructive like the LIMODMANIAC does perhaps the state of modified racing would change. Something good, from the heart, unselfish and with a strong desire to make things better. If you would like to know anymore just drop me a line or call.

By the way, let me ask you these few questions: Was it you or your source that started the story that James is going to drive the newly formed Kyle Bush Motorsports Modified Team? Was it you or your source that started the story that Edward is in the 79 for 2012? Was it you or your source that started the story that I am getting out the Modified series and going to the Nationwide Series with a RoushYates deal?

So as Bugg's Bunny really said "that's all folk's" and that's a fact you should stick to.:wave:

[Jaws]

Best statement from all the posts, "If you spent as much time doing something constructive like the LIMODMANIAC does perhaps the state of modified racing would change." Here here! Lets hope all the cars mentioned in the last few days make it back stronger than ever plus some of our other racing friends who have not seen too much track time over the past couple of years. We all love the modifieds and seeing nights like the Lighthouse 200 at Riverhead makes me feel if we all work togetherthe tour can be strong again.

[LiquidBread]

Remember the good old days with single day shows at Lee, Beech Ridge, Waterford and Oswego

Amen CT ..... Holland, Perry, and Lancaster too for that matter!

[nymods]

I am with a mod team that is trying to get a car together to run some tour shows. unfortunately it probably wont be ready until New Hampshire, so that only leaves a couple shows left to run. We are thinking about the costs for all of the licences for the driver, crew, owner, etc. and wondering if it is worth trying to make 2 shows. I like the idea of still being able to race even if you do not have a tour license, but you just cant collect any points towards the point fund. I thin kyou'd see an extra handful of guys at every race if nascar would allow this. Not everyone can run the full tour or even half the tour, but many can run a few shows, but dont becasue of the cost to attempt just those few.

[JWfor8x]

Nascar has to increase the point fund, and include more drivers in the point fund. There should be at least a million dollar point fund and the payout should be to the top 25-30 drivers.

Television coverage is a must. That the K and N series has all races televised and the modifieds have only two is sickening.

If something isn't done soon, I'm afraid the tour will be in big trouble next year.

Jim, I believe that you're right on the point fund, the payout the television coverage and the trouble that the tour is in and will be in next year. That being said, with the possible exception of the modifieds getting some more television coverage, I don't expect an increased point fund and I don't expect that the payout will go to the top 25 to 30 drivers. I also don't think that they will institute any rules changes to make the racing better than it has been this year. Instead, I think they will continue to have the tour copy the Cup series with boring time trial qualifying and heads up fields based on qualifying. That may be fine with 400 and 500 mile races, but it does not work well on the WMT. I understand that time trials are less expensive for the teams than heat races, so I don't have a problem with that. I do think that they should go back to the top 6, 8 or 10 time trialers drawing for starting position. I understand the basic unfairness of this, but I think it helps make for better racing and thus more fan support. They will also keep that ridiculous "lucky dog" rule, which I think is a bad joke. I don't believe that NASCAR is going to do anything that will be of much benefit for the WMT or for that matter, the WSMT either. In my opinion, NASCAR only cares about making huge profits and they don't consider the WMT as a major part of that Maybe NASCAR will do something to prove that I am just cynical, and I really do hope that they do, but until that happens, I always expect the worst from them.

JW

[Rabbit504]

Shame on you Buggs for trying to stir trouble and post misleading information. I am just a phone call away if you wanted to know something but then again you wouldn't have been able to sensationalize on the truth. I'll give you a little more than what was in a previous post. On a personal note I was out of work and out of commission for six weeks due to health issues and just starting to get back slowly. During that time our race team performed 110% and did everything any car owner could ask for in his or her absence. The pain of missing races especially the first NH race was worse than the physical pain I had. What you don't know is the the relationship I have with people that drive my race cars. Show me just one driver that would give up their seat in a car for another driver. Well Tony did that so Edward would have a ride but more so because he believed it was in my best interest and yes he calls me every week. Edward and I have been friends for twenty years and so there is a bond that is way more important than any owner/driver arrangement could have. We have no secrets. When I wanted to try to run two cars at a couple of races he was the first person I told because someone like you would have loved to twist the truth and fabricate a story. While I take what you say as worthless I'm writing this because what was said affects a lot of people, fans, sponsors, crew, family and friends.

As was stated we suffered a motor loss and more at NH last week, that combined with business conditions and the cost involved to just travel to Bristol and Canada I don't have the necessary funding to compete in these races unless I want to forget about the races that follow them. Now, if you would like to sponsor us for these races I'll be happy to make a change in plans as my entry has already been sent in. With this understanding I suggested to Edward to try to make other arrangements for these races. Yes, he has talked to the Hills and they are in the process of working things out. You SEE Bugg's not behind my back but with full knowledge so people like you who do what you do just keep loosing credibility.

If you spent as much time doing something constructive like the LIMODMANIAC does perhaps the state of modified racing would change. Something good, from the heart, unselfish and with a strong desire to make things better. If you would like to know anymore just drop me a line or call.

By the way, let me ask you these few questions: Was it you or your source that started the story that James is going to drive the newly formed Kyle Bush Motorsports Modified Team? Was it you or your source that started the story that Edward is in the 79 for 2012? Was it you or your source that started the story that I am getting out the Modified series and going to the Nationwide Series with a RoushYates deal?

So as Bugg's Bunny really said "that's all folk's" and that's a fact you should stick to.:wave:


Well M T, Looks like I owe you an apology.
However, my post was not meant to be the way some people took it.
I just wanted to bring to light the fate of the small teams.

And to answer your questions,( I owe you that).
Don't know anything about Kyle Busch Motorsports Modified team. (is there one?)
Edward going to the 79. (I doubt it after the last time)
And you starting a Nationwide Team. (is Edward the driver?).
Did any of these post have words misspelled? ( I can't spell.)
Don't know where this stuff is written, but it wasn't me.
James is a very good friend, however I don't speak to him much since he no longer lives in his home town and hasn't for well over a year.

I do take offense to Francis .
I never talked to or meet him, yet he says I was "bragging" about something.
He did the same thing I did, But hey, that's OK.

To close, and these are my last words on a mistake I made.
I am truly sorry Gary for upsetting you.
I respect that you spend your hard earned money doing something you love to do.
If I get to the track again this year I will apologize to you face to face.

[chrome horn]

Ray,
You can say I did the same thing all you want, once again, when I heard it, I didn't coming running on here to look like a hero, because I DIDN'T have all the facts, even though I saw the text messages and the decal you sent. I called you out here merely for the point you like to stir it up. You know the truth, and so do I in regards to what I said in the previous post. I'm still waiting for the gift you told our mutual friend you were going to give me after it was brought up on that "2 watt radio show".

[Rabbit504]

OK this is it for me I'm not saying another thing after this:

1. you need to seek professional help.
2. you need to take your medication.
3. no matter what: don't take that helmet of, you can't afford anymore damage.

[chrome horn]

You're just mad because the voices only talk to me!!!