Start and Park

[MOD11RACER]

The WMT teams should do what the Nationwide and Cup series teams do. Start and Park at Loudon. When the green flag falls and starting on lap 2 one car should drop out on every lap until one car is left racing. The Modifieds do not need Loudon anymore. Run the Speedbowl 3 times a year. It would be a cost savings to the teams. Isn't that what NASCAR keeps telling us ? They have to save the Tour owners money and NASCAR knows best. Hell NASCAR doesn't even know what a Modified is. Never mind the cost of one or the cost to run one.

Look Ryan Newman running all by himself with his Spec Motor.

Jason what do you think ?

How about you Chad any comment ? Big time cost savings.

[bud]

Definitely would make a statement.....would they spank them all like they did Teddy.... will never happen. Heck in a perfect world Bruton would get wind of this and spank whoever made this decision and give the mods a pay hike to make up for the bs thats going on now. Btw I can see way less northern teams headed to bristol!

[Magicshoes12]

Great Quote from Doug Coby.......As far as the purse reduction at Loudon, N.H., Saturday’s winner Doug Coby said despite the cuts, the purse, including the winner’s share, is still the best of the 14 races on the tour, and drivers should take heed of that.

“Nobody has to pay Modified drivers or a team to go to a track. That’s an important thing to remember,” Coby said. “People can say everybody should win this much money at Loudon … or that the Stafford 125 should pay more than it does, (but) the bottom line is that everyone has a choice as to whether they walk into the pits that day.

“I have a choice, as the point leader, that if I don’t agree with what they’re doing at Loudon, I don’t have to show up. I can go and sit in my pool all day. I will be there because I want to race in the series and I want to represent my team and my family and go out there and have a good time. I don’t care what their rules are. They could run a 35-lap feature at Loudon and I will still go out there and run it.”

Rest of the Article....http://www.norwichbulletin.com/sports/motorsports/x2102587501/Drivers-deny-Whelen-Modified-Tour-troubles#axzz1yoU33cUu

[MXCHAMP04]

Great Quote from Doug Coby.......As far as the purse reduction at Loudon, N.H., Saturday’s winner Doug Coby said despite the cuts, the purse, including the winner’s share, is still the best of the 14 races on the tour, and drivers should take heed of that.

“Nobody has to pay Modified drivers or a team to go to a track. That’s an important thing to remember,” Coby said. “People can say everybody should win this much money at Loudon … or that the Stafford 125 should pay more than it does, (but) the bottom line is that everyone has a choice as to whether they walk into the pits that day.

“I have a choice, as the point leader, that if I don’t agree with what they’re doing at Loudon, I don’t have to show up. I can go and sit in my pool all day. I will be there because I want to race in the series and I want to represent my team and my family and go out there and have a good time. I don’t care what their rules are. They could run a 35-lap feature at Loudon and I will still go out there and run it.”

Rest of the Article....http://www.norwichbulletin.com/sports/motorsports/x2102587501/Drivers-deny-Whelen-Modified-Tour-troubles#axzz1yoU33cUuVery easy to say when you're the current points leader. I've been there many times racing bikes, but the series was messed up. i just went about my business not rustling too many feathers, meanwhile I couldn't stand all the BS, and kept it to myself.

[Acadia]

Magicshoes12, pay attention...

Before this season, Coby was considered one of the best drivers without a ride. He was a journeyman driver. May have had a previous full time season, I think it was with Chace. Why has he been without a ride? Three reasons: Funding, funding, and less funding. Now that Coby is running with the means of two blended teams, he is taking the position that he has a choice to run. Amazing what funding can do, eh? Now he's making it sound like he's a fat cat and he decides what he is going to do. They don't decide to go... they look in the checkbook and if there's money, they go. There's no decision, who does he think he's kidding? Do you really think he'd say he doesn't feel like racing today, he'd rather lounge around the pool instead? Go ahead Doug, choose to hang out in the pool instead of racing. See if you ever get another ride. Prior to this season, funding decided what he did and didn't do. And funding decides and enables what he does today. If the blended teams fall apart, he isn't driving. It isn't a decision. This is a full season for Coby and it is tenuous at that due to the blending of two teams. Prior to this season, he would probably say racing was too expensive and the purses didn't pay enough so he could afford to run. So he is ecstatic to be running what he has, and certainly would find only good to say about the situation. He has been looking for a full time ride for years and now has it, even though it is really two part-time rides. After all the ups and downs Coby has had, and time without a ride, he is living a dream right now and is in no position to say anything but love. First and foremost, he is building his brand equity to improve his chances of getting a ride next season. If Coby doesn't march to NASCAR's song, it could get difficult and expensive for his present blended teams, or future team. He can't afford that.

When Coby is fully funding his own operation at the levels of the present top Tour teams, then he can say he decides to race or lounge in his pool. Until then, he has obligations to the teams that are putting him in a ride, or he is harming his chances of ever driving again if he should decide to lounge in his pool instead of drive. He is going to jump at any opportunity to get behind a wheel, no decision there.

And it helps to never disagree with NASCAR no matter what, for they can make things just miserable and expensive. Someone like Christopher has significant brand equity and can tweak NASCAR once in awhile. Someone like Coby has zero brand equity and will be annihilated by NASCAR and nobody will even notice.

And Coby should care, very much, what the rules are.

But what about the talent and owners that aren't running? Don King came back after announcing he was leaving, Art Barry is running MRS, Fiore is gone, Pasteryak, Chace, ... These are modified staples, along with others that don't run anymore. They had a choice and exercised it. In an interview several years ago, Mike Stefanik said the thing that alarms him is the lack of owners willing to run. They can run, but decided not to run anymore. Why did they leave?

Now the reporter should ask drivers like Christopher, Stefanik, Flemke, etc., guys that have been around a long time. Coby, Preece, and Bonsignore are newbies and are just ecstatic to be driving. They don't have the wisdom of Christopher, Stefanik, Flemke, etc. to see where things have come from and the trend.



Great Quote from Doug Coby.......As far as the purse reduction at Loudon, N.H., Saturday’s winner Doug Coby said despite the cuts, the purse, including the winner’s share, is still the best of the 14 races on the tour, and drivers should take heed of that.

“Nobody has to pay Modified drivers or a team to go to a track. That’s an important thing to remember,” Coby said. “People can say everybody should win this much money at Loudon … or that the Stafford 125 should pay more than it does, (but) the bottom line is that everyone has a choice as to whether they walk into the pits that day.

“I have a choice, as the point leader, that if I don’t agree with what they’re doing at Loudon, I don’t have to show up. I can go and sit in my pool all day. I will be there because I want to race in the series and I want to represent my team and my family and go out there and have a good time. I don’t care what their rules are. They could run a 35-lap feature at Loudon and I will still go out there and run it.”

Rest of the Article....http://www.norwichbulletin.com/sports/motorsports/x2102587501/Drivers-deny-Whelen-Modified-Tour-troubles#axzz1yoU33cUu

[Sicklajoie]

Doug's "blended team", as you call it, was last year. This year is all with Wayne Darling's equipment for the WMT.

[TnLRacing]

Acadia, you should get your facts straight before you post. Coby had a full time ride with the 28, and left to drive the #77. The team he is driving for this year is owned 100% by Wayne Darling, not a blended team as you call it. Coby has been around this tour for a very long time, and deserves alot more respect than you are giving him. Believe this Coby has a giant set, and if the situation arose where floating in the pool looked better than racing you can believe he would walk away.

[RGeeProductions]

Mike, Coby is a newbie and only seasoned veterans are god's word to Acadia. You will also find out he is never wrong... Chace??? LOL

[stabone]

Acadia heres to hoping your computer get fully infected with a nice fresh virus.....

[RGeeProductions]

Shoulda had him paged at Waterford...... LOL

[BigMac]

The WMT teams should do what the Nationwide and Cup series teams do. Start and Park at Loudon. When the green flag falls and starting on lap 2 one car should drop out on every lap until one car is left racing. The Modifieds do not need Loudon anymore. Run the Speedbowl 3 times a year. It would be a cost savings to the teams. Isn't that what NASCAR keeps telling us ? They have to save the Tour owners money and NASCAR knows best. Hell NASCAR doesn't even know what a Modified is. Never mind the cost of one or the cost to run one.

Look Ryan Newman running all by himself with his Spec Motor.

Jason what do you think ?

How about you Chad any comment ? Big time cost savings.

Thats the dumbest idea I've ever heard. First off, its not in a drivers DNA to go onto the track and not race. Especially after hauling up to NH and spending two days in tech and practice. As a fan I would probably never go to another race again at any level if they did that. Imagine a dad spending his hard earned money to bring his kids to a race only to have that happen. It would be wrong on so many levels that I don't know where to begin. NHMS still pays more than Waterford(or any other race) so it can't be all bad. Although I still won't go unless they drop the halftime deal. That's how I voice my opinion on matters.

[csammy]

Acadia and the others as far as the veteran drivers speaking there mind to chad and the rest of the nascar officals stefanik flemke did ask to speak there mind at a drivers meeting questioning a restart call i think either last year or the year before they were told the drivers meeting is not the place to adress the issue come in the trailer and we will talk about it here was two veteran drivers asking a question and what did chad and the rest of the officals do they slaped steffy flemkes hand and basically said dont question us look at the black flag call at the ice breaker so why would any veteran driver stick his neck out

[csg]

Thats the dumbest idea I've ever heard. First off, its not in a drivers DNA to go onto the track and not race. Especially after hauling up to NH and spending two days in tech and practice. As a fan I would probably never go to another race again at any level if they did that. Imagine a dad spending his hard earned money to bring his kids to a race only to have that happen. It would be wrong on so many levels that I don't know where to begin. NHMS still pays more than Waterford(or any other race) so it can't be all bad. Although I still won't go unless they drop the halftime deal. That's how I voice my opinion on matters.

I believe the F1 race at indy had a large portion of their field of drivers start and park....and that race isnt run anymore after Indy spent millions putting in that track. And that was done by the drivers for safety reasons. I dont think a strike would do any good, just more harm.

What I dont understand is why someone doesnt pull a car out of the weeds and run around the back to collect a paycheck. There have been short fields at most events this season. Must mean the fee's to enter are too high and you can not possibly make a return running the event unless you finish up front.. Nascar needs to reduce the cost to run an event. I can tell you the basically which cars will be at the races, there is no outsiders coming in to race on the tour for a race or two. When the tour came to Monadnock last year I dont remember one of the regulars weekly series cars running the event at there home track.

[csammy]

it would ge great if the owners and drivers finally did something to catch the eyes of chad and the rest of the tour officals even better how about reporters brian danko a big supporter of the tour polly reid dale wolbrink ron mentus what if they started questioning chad asking for answears on what happening on the tour maybe articles from them might finally put chad and the rest on notice that what they say and do are not whats best for the tour maybe they will listen to the drivers and owners for a change

[CuriousGeorge]

what i dont understand is why someone doesnt pull a car out of the weeds and run around the back to collect a paycheck. There have been short fields at most events this season. Must mean the fee's to enter are too high and you can not possibly make a return running the event unless you finish up front.. Nascar needs to reduce the cost to run an event. I can tell you the basically which cars will be at the races, there is no outsiders coming in to race on the tour for a race or two. When the tour came to monadnock last year i dont remember one of the regulars weekly series cars running the event at there home track.

bingo.....

[Acadia]

csg, yeah, I think it was a F1 race, and I think the issue was tires, the tires were't safe for the track so the drivers drove off at the drop of the green. That was all over the news.

What people have to understand is that this is a hobby for the owners, not a profit center. Second place and lower doesn't come close to covering the cost to run a car in most races. First place at a couple events like Loudon and Bristol might. But then, NASCAR doesn't post winnings anymore, probably because it was rather dismal when the Tour champ wins $70K over the season. A tire bill for the season will run $20-25K. You are going to spend truckloads of $$$$$, and win pocket change.

That's what most of the yapping on this forum has been about... the paltry purses that don't pay the costs to race.

And while we are on it, it is interesting that the winnings for the Cup are posted. The winnings there don't come close to cover the costs to run a car for a season. Sponsorship and TV makes up the difference. It's been reported that it costs $20 million to run a Cup team for one season. And we are out of line when we grumble that our Tour can't get thrown a few bones, or when the owners get squeezed even more.




I believe the F1 race at indy had a large portion of their field of drivers start and park....and that race isnt run anymore after Indy spent millions putting in that track. And that was done by the drivers for safety reasons. I dont think a strike would do any good, just more harm.

What I dont understand is why someone doesnt pull a car out of the weeds and run around the back to collect a paycheck. There have been short fields at most events this season. Must mean the fee's to enter are too high and you can not possibly make a return running the event unless you finish up front.. Nascar needs to reduce the cost to run an event. I can tell you the basically which cars will be at the races, there is no outsiders coming in to race on the tour for a race or two. When the tour came to Monadnock last year I dont remember one of the regulars weekly series cars running the event at there home track.

[rim runner]

it would ge great if the owners and drivers finally did something to catch the eyes of chad and the rest of the tour officals

Like starting a rival series?

[Acadia]

Rival series? Nah, replacement series.


Like starting a rival series?

[mod35]

Richie
Why would you say Chase???? lol the Chases were great people and ran the tour for many years with many good drivers

[JWfor8x]

csg, yeah, I think it was a F1 race, and I think the issue was tires, the tires were't safe for the track so the drivers drove off at the drop of the green. That was all over the news.

What people have to understand is that this is a hobby for the owners, not a profit center. Second place and lower doesn't come close to covering the cost to run a car in most races. First place at a couple events like Loudon and Bristol might. But then, NASCAR doesn't post winnings anymore, probably because it was rather dismal when the Tour champ wins $70K over the season. A tire bill for the season will run $20-25K. You are going to spend truckloads of $$$$$, and win pocket change.

That's what most of the yapping on this forum has been about... the paltry purses that don't pay the costs to race.

And while we are on it, it is interesting that the winnings for the Cup are posted. The winnings there don't come close to cover the costs to run a car for a season. Sponsorship and TV makes up the difference. It's been reported that it costs $20 million to run a Cup team for one season. And we are out of line when we grumble that our Tour can't get thrown a few bones, or when the owners get squeezed even more.

Acadia, I don't think that you or anyone else is out of line for grumbling and expressing your opinion on what's wrong with the WMT. I think you start to get out of line by expressing the same opinions over and over to people who really don't have any power to enact the changes that you want. For example, a few years ago I was watching a cup race, something that I rarely do, and didn't like the restart procedure in the race. I found out David Hoots e-mail address and wrote to him questioning the procedure. He wrote back with a detailed explanation as to why the ruling was enacted. I saw the ruling in a completely different light and even though I still didn't think it was right, I had more knowledge on which to base my opinion. I didn't waste my or anyone else's time on an internet forum trying to impress people as powerless as I with my wisdom. My point is simply this, the blather gets tiresome.

[Acadia]

Although I still won't go unless they drop the halftime deal.



BigMac, please, I beg you to go to Loudon. You won't be noticed by not going to Loudon. Going and commenting will be so much more effective. I'm going and hoping to see a good race. If not, I will have a laugh, and I won't go to the next race that has a competition caution, or similar cost improvements. But I will give it a chance. I am very open-minded and cooperative, but if given a reason otherwise, all bets are off.

[Acadia]

Too bad you feel so powerless.

That was great work on your part to contact Hoots. Too bad you chose to keep that info to yourself and not share with others that were probably wondering the same.

Now if NWMT PR would see the way to shut down the "need-to-know" policy about letting those other than teams know what the rules are, things would be so much better.

See how that works? You can be a drone in the Apple 1984 commercial, or you can throw the sledge hammer. Your choice.

But forums such as these have affected good change, and there is an opportunity right now to affect very important change.

You can be a part or it, or walk away. Speak up, or remain powerless. Your choice.

I guess now is where I should say I hope your PC gets infected by a virus, but that's not me.

Whatever you do, don't be afraid of the bellicosity. They are nothing more than entertainment.



Acadia, I don't think that you or anyone else is out of line for grumbling and expressing your opinion on what's wrong with the WMT. I think you start to get out of line by expressing the same opinions over and over to people who really don't have any power to enact the changes that you want. For example, a few years ago I was watching a cup race, something that I rarely do, and didn't like the restart procedure in the race. I found out David Hoots e-mail address and wrote to him questioning the procedure. He wrote back with a detailed explanation as to why the ruling was enacted. I saw the ruling in a completely different light and even though I still didn't think it was right, I had more knowledge on which to base my opinion. I didn't waste my or anyone else's time on an internet forum trying to impress people as powerless as I with my wisdom. My point is simply this, the blather gets tiresome.

[CuriousGeorge]

http://www.racedayct.com/article/NHMS_Mangement_Hardly_Villains_Trying_To_Kill_The_ NASCAR_Whelen_Modified_Tour

[MJProcko]

http://www.racedayct.com/article/NHMS_Mangement_Hardly_Villains_Trying_To_Kill_The_ NASCAR_Whelen_Modified_Tour

Yes there are people who just like to hear theselves complain but sorry Shawn, you missed the boat on this one. 1st place paid aroud 20k at NH 20 years ago, it just dropped from 14k to 10k this year. Costs have increased by more than 50% just in what they have to pay Nascar to race alone. Heck it costs a crew member a $250 license fee just to hold the gas can on pit stops(admission not inc.) If your pay dropped 50% over 2 decades but your costs increased by more than that at your job how happy are you going to be? Yes those tracks don't have WMT races anymore, why? Because they can't afford to pay what Nascar wants to host them. They still have smaller Mod series to their tracks so they still modifieds. In other words the problem is not the whiny racers, fans and car owners. it's Nascar, the guys who paid Joe Nemechek Sunday 72k to run one lap through the California wine country and park his car.

[Acadia]

I'm really laughing at those pitching goodness at Loudon being one of the highest paying purses for the year. It might be the only one where first place pays more than what it cost a team to run the race.

Teams run Loudon for that big payout to reduce the costs of running the season. Let's not overlook the cars that run Loudon as the few selected races that they run. There's a good reason for that.

What is so hard to understand?

[ShawnCourchesne]

Come one Acadia, really? Don't come on here and act like you have any knowledge of the budget of any team running in the series. You don't even know what team the series points leader drives for but somehow you have inside knowledge of the budgets of the teams involved? That's hilarious. First place won't even make what it costs to run the race? Here, I'll challenge you, it will be a waste of my time, but I'll challenge you nonetheless. Back up your statement with some fact, post an itemized and authentic budget for that event for a Whelen Modified Tour team that shows there's validity to what you just said. I won't hold my breath waiting for your response. It's the same thing all the time from your posts, general, mostly nonsensical statements that aren't backed up in anything close to fact. If you're going to complain about everything that is wrong, how about taking just five minutes to educate yourself about the subject matter at hand first.

[JWfor8x]

Too bad you feel so powerless.

That was great work on your part to contact Hoots. Too bad you chose to keep that info to yourself and not share with others that were probably wondering the same.

Now if NWMT PR would see the way to shut down the "need-to-know" policy about letting those other than teams know what the rules are, things would be so much better.

See how that works? You can be a drone in the Apple 1984 commercial, or you can throw the sledge hammer. Your choice.

But forums such as these have affected good change, and there is an opportunity right now to affect very important change.

You can be a part or it, or walk away. Speak up, or remain powerless. Your choice.

I guess now is where I should say I hope your PC gets infected by a virus, but that's not me.

Whatever you do, don't be afraid of the bellicosity. They are nothing more than entertainment.

Well, Acadia, I'm really not surprised but it seems that you missed my point. My point is simply this. While you are entertained by your ramblings and presumably by the responses that they evoke, I am not, instead, I find you boring.

[csammy]

just saw on speed 51 that mike christopher is going to run N.H. could he be a start an park car personally i dont think so he has had a few decent runs there makes you wonder if more teams are thinking of it knowing that they may not have a full field

[BigMac]

BigMac, please, I beg you to go to Loudon. You won't be noticed by not going to Loudon. Going and commenting will be so much more effective. I'm going and hoping to see a good race. If not, I will have a laugh, and I won't go to the next race that has a competition caution, or similar cost improvements. But I will give it a chance. I am very open-minded and cooperative, but if given a reason otherwise, all bets are off.

I just don't agree with the format. If I don't agree with the format I won't go. Its that simple. Emailing and insulting NHMS, Whelen and/or anyone else isn't going to get folks far as Shawn indicated in his article today. I love the tour and I especially love NHMS. I haven't missed too many shows there over the years. They are by far my favorite events. I just happened to decide that I wanted to sit this one out in protest. Maybe it will be my loss. If they change the format back I will be there. I still haven't heard a legit reason for making the change.

[ShawnCourchesne]

just saw on speed 51 that mike christopher is going to run N.H. could he be a start an park car personally i dont think so he has had a few decent runs there makes you wonder if more teams are thinking of it knowing that they may not have a full field

You don't know Mike Christopher too well if you think he'd go anywhere to be a start and park with a Modified. He's about as competitive as there is. Funny, he's a guy doing everything out of pocket, working on his own stuff, and he's not staying away because the purse got cut. As a matter of fact, I think he's pretty amped up to get the chance to go back there. And he didn't complain at all about the 50-lap break. Odd.

[bud]

No he needs to pass tech first lol..... Shawn you looking to NHIS as a potential site sponsor. How can you defend this......omg

[Acadia]

bada-bing!




No he needs to pass tech first lol..... Shawn you looking to NHIS as a potential site sponsor. How can you defend this......omg

[Acadia]

I still haven't heard a legit reason for making the change.

Yes, I agree. That is interesting.

The teams still have to show up on Thursday for tech. Where's the cost improvement there? TnLRacing also brought that up to NWMT PR and there still hasn't been an answer. Maybe if the teams didn't have to show up until Friday, that cost savings could prevent the competition caution.

[ShawnCourchesne]

No he needs to pass tech first lol..... Shawn you looking to NHIS as a potential site sponsor. How can you defend this......omg

What's NHIS? I've said it before and I'll say it again, the reason for most of all the negativity is people who live in the past and can't accept what reality is today. I remember when I could go to the mall and buy new sneakers for $12. Can't do that today, but that doesn't mean I stopped wearing shoes out of protest. Doesn't mean I go to the mall and complain to everybody the moment I walk in about how bad it is today trying to buy a pair of sneakers. No, because the reality is, it's a different world than 25 years ago and I can accept that.

You call it NHIS. Live in the past much?

And no, they're not an advertiser on the site. I actually just put up some boxes for their events because I'm going to be covering them. Haven't taken a dime from them.

[ShawnCourchesne]

Yes, I agree. That is interesting.

The teams still have to show up on Thursday for tech. Where's the cost improvement there? TnLRacing also brought that up to NWMT PR and there still hasn't been an answer. Maybe if the teams didn't have to show up until Friday, that cost savings could prevent the competition caution.

Acadia, where is your response? Where is your itemized budget for the a Whelen Modified Tour team going to NHMS to show how a team winning the race will lose money?

Come on, you said it, back it up. Why are you so scared to back up your words with some evidence of fact.

Oh I remember, because you live in a world where fact doesn't mean anything, you just make it all up.

For someone that posts on here as much as you do you would think you would have the courage to at least attempt to back up what you say with some fact. No, you just use falsehoods and lies to make your insistences. Just like quoting from the story you keep quoting from. The same story that claims the entire purse for the July 14 event at NHMS is $10,7000. How about quoting from stories based in fact, not based on numbers that aren't even close to being correct. I'd rather trust in a story where the author has some idea what they're writing about rather than a story that claims the entire starting field is splitting up $10,700.

So I'll ask again, maybe you can just attempt to try and respond (you won't because it's all lies you spew here anyways). Please Acadia, post an itemized and REAL budget for a Whelen Modified Tour team traveling to that race on July 14 that shows that the team that wins the race will lose money.

Please, back up what you're saying, give your words some legitimacy. Until then you're just a crap talking liar simply pulling statements out of the air and making them up in the fantasy little world you live in.
You should go make sure your Unicorn is fed Acadia.

[Acadia]

I'm not going to do your for job for you. You are supposed to be the investigative reporter.

You are in no position to challenge anyone. You are showing up unarmed for a gun fight. You don't even have a knife. You would love for someone to hand the costs to run a car to you, because then you would know. Here's a secret... it's not hard to find out. And if you don't know how by now, too bad. Okay, here's a hint: it's too obvious. You can find out while sitting down. I'm not going to hand it to you. I'm going to continue to be entertained by you. Do your own homework.

Several years ago, TC was interviewed and the challenges facing the Tour came up and TC said it cost an average of ~$5,500 to run a car in an event. I had wondered about the disparities between costs and purses before that, but then hearing that from TC really caught my interest. Now you go and make a list of first place winnings per event that exceed $5,500. What did first place a the recent Waterford race pay? A couple years ago, the IceBreaker paid ~$5K to win, and that was a good purse. TC has been your bread and butter, you aren't going to turn on him now, are you? Why didn't you do the story with TC that the Norwich Bulletin did? Or do you think TC is out of his mind and fabricating that story? Please state if you agree or disagree with TC in the Norwich Bulletin article. The correct answer kills your challenge. And if you disagree with TC, challenge him. Please, challenge TC.



Come one Acadia, really? Don't come on here and act like you have any knowledge of the budget of any team running in the series. You don't even know what team the series points leader drives for but somehow you have inside knowledge of the budgets of the teams involved? That's hilarious. First place won't even make what it costs to run the race? Here, I'll challenge you, it will be a waste of my time, but I'll challenge you nonetheless. Back up your statement with some fact, post an itemized and authentic budget for that event for a Whelen Modified Tour team that shows there's validity to what you just said. I won't hold my breath waiting for your response. It's the same thing all the time from your posts, general, mostly nonsensical statements that aren't backed up in anything close to fact. If you're going to complain about everything that is wrong, how about taking just five minutes to educate yourself about the subject matter at hand first.

[Acadia]

But you are looking at NHMS as a potential sponsor, as Bud said. Would that be correct?




Nope, they're not an advertiser on the site. I actually just put up some boxes for their events because I'm going to be covering them. Haven't taken a dime from them.

[ShawnCourchesne]

I'm not going to do your for job for you. You are supposed to be the investigative reporter.

As usual, Acadia talks a lot of smack about something he doesn't know anything about then when asked to back it up with some factual numbers he cowers away like the liar that he is. Hilarious. If you're going to say it, back it up, simple as that. You said it, now you got challenged to back it up and you have NOTHING. Another Acadia Fantasy World lie.

Go back to quoting from your story that says the entire field is racing for a purse of $10,700.

Hey look, there's Acadia riding his Unicorn with his Leprechaun buddy !!!! I bet you can produce the monthly budget for what you spend on your Unicorn's food at Acadia's Wild and Wacky World of Fantasy.

[Acadia]

NHIS is New Hampshire International Speedway, the former name of NHMS, New Hampshire Motor Speedway.

And once again, back to the issue...

Are you looking at NHMS (formerly NHIS) as a potential site sponsor?



What's NHIS? I've said it before and I'll say it again, the reason for most of all the negativity is people who live in the past and can't accept what reality is today. I remember when I could go to the mall and buy new sneakers for $12. Can't do that today, but that doesn't mean I stopped wearing shoes out of protest. Doesn't mean I go to the mall and complain to everybody the moment I walk in about how bad it is today trying to buy a pair of sneakers. No, because the reality is, it's a different world than 25 years ago and I can accept that.

You call it NHIS. Live in the past much?

And no, they're not an advertiser on the site. I actually just put up some boxes for their events because I'm going to be covering them. Haven't taken a dime from them.

[RGeeProductions]

Listen folks. Stop the BS bashing on members and other things here (throughout the forum) NOW.

Constructive posting on thoughts, solutions, ideas, etc are great (positive AND negative). Putting down tracks, other members, reporters, claiming tracks or NASCAR is pocketing money from purses/sponsors (I'd be real careful on that one) is starting to push the limits here and it's not happening anymore.

And Acadia, Shawn does do his homework. He calls or interviews in person for most of his writings. And gee, he does get his own opinion also. You, on the other hand, like to carry things on forever, twist things or change subjects at will. (and no First Amendment BS. This is a private forum you signed up for so that doesn't work here and we have been very open so far) Gee, 2 threads on spec motors and 1/2 time show thread? You just mock many things (Read your post above. Totally unnecessary but I guess you couldn't find anything else to say, but just HAD to say something) and it really wastes area on this forum. And from now on nonsense will be deleted, and that is for anyone.

Jason Cunningham has been kind enough to join and add some posts here. Originally he had told me he would not be answering any questions here and only post when something important needs to put out. Well guess he changed his originally intent, which I appreciate, and many of you have ripped him apart. HE DOESN'T MAKE THE RULES FOR THE NWMT! He is NASCAR's PR guy for the Mod Tour and K&N Series. That's all! And there are many things he does not know or have access to. He also does not have to answer any questions about things NASCAR members have access to. What is so hard to understand about this? Any club, institution, organization that has membership does this. Oh it's a big secret... Are you kidding me??? Most info is available and if not, become a member like you would any other organization. PERIOD

Now decent threads and thoughts get started and it seems it ends with member against member fights instead of reasonable debates.
Please stop it, everyone, or we will, and we really don't want to have to do that.

THIS IS NOT DEBATABLE....

TCH Admin

[jaFor]

Thank you, Rich, for a well written plea for civility. However, Acadia seems to have an inability to comprehend so I wonder how much good it will do in his case. As I stated in the thread about the state of the modified tour, the best solution to the Acadia "problem" is to ignore him. Responses to his posts only serve to "feed" him.

[ShawnCourchesne]

Thanks Richie. Constructively debating topics, negative and positive, is healthy and should be done. But spreading a never-ending stream of half-truths and out-and-out lies about the issues at hand doesn't help anyone, and in the end will likely only serve to hurt the teams, the drivers and the series overall.

[Howie]

Listen folks. Stop the BS bashing on members and other things here (throughout the forum) NOW.

Constructive posting on thoughts, solutions, ideas, etc are great (positive AND negative). Putting down tracks, other members, reporters, claiming tracks or NASCAR is pocketing money from purses/sponsors (I'd be real careful on that one) is starting to push the limits here and it's not happening anymore.

And Acadia, Shawn does do his homework. He calls or interviews in person for most of his writings. And gee, he does get his own opinion also. You, on the other hand, like to carry things on forever, twist things or change subjects at will. (and no First Amendment BS. This is a private forum you signed up for so that doesn't work here and we have been very open so far) Gee, 2 threads on spec motors and 1/2 time show thread? You just mock many things (Read your post above. Totally unnecessary but I guess you couldn't find anything else to say, but just HAD to say something) and it really wastes area on this forum. And from now on nonsense will be deleted, and that is for anyone.

Jason Cunningham has been kind enough to join and add some posts here. Originally he had told me he would not be answering any questions here and only post when something important needs to put out. Well guess he changed his originally intent, which I appreciate, and many of you have ripped him apart. HE DOESN'T MAKE THE RULES FOR THE NWMT! He is NASCAR's PR guy for the Mod Tour and K&N Series. That's all! And there are many things he does not know or have access to. He also does not have to answer any questions about things NASCAR members have access to. What is so hard to understand about this? Any club, institution, organization that has membership does this. Oh it's a big secret... Are you kidding me??? Most info is available and if not, become a member like you would any other organization. PERIOD

Now decent threads and thoughts get started and it seems it ends with member against member fights instead of reasonable debates.
Please stop it, everyone, or we will, and we really don't want to have to do that.

THIS IS NOT DEBATABLE....

TCH Admin

I agree with Richie on this 100%. Mr. Acadia might have a little credibility with his rants if he identified himself and let people know what his credentials are to back his statements. Shawn, Jason, Richie, and most of the poster know each other and are known by everyone. Mr. Acadia hides behind a screen name with his subtle innuendos, demeaning to everyone who disagrees with him, demanding that he is right. Richie is right - it is time for everyone to treat everyone else with more respect. You can state your opinion here with out putting down others opinions. I am proud of most of you for keeping things civil here.

[bud]

Shawn I remember when mod tires were $80 too but my pay has gone up to. Funny how you jump on NHIS instead of admitting to the problem at hand. A great show on speedway line report would be Mario and you debating the current state of the WMT!

[Acadia]

Are you looking at NHMS as a potential site sponsor?

It gets complicated. Things like this can get messy.

If I look at the site, it looks like NHMS advertising. These "boxes" as you call them look to be informing visitors that tickets are available at NHMS for $49 and $19. Looks like NHMS advertising. Nice artwork for the boxes. It doesn't make sense to give NHMS exposure for ticket prices simply because you will be covering NHMS with no remuneration. A person doesn't have to be an economist to know that you have to pander to site sponsors and potential site sponsors.

Please answer the question, are you looking at NHMS as a potential site sponsor?

Simple question, simple answer, please. Multiple choice question: yes or no.

If the answer is "no", it would be hard to believe. But if you want to provide advertising and promotion for NHMS for no remuneration, that's your business decision. If the answer is "yes", then it is complicated. Forums like this shouldn't be the place for businesses to promote their business interests. If so, they should be subject to unfettered challenges, not coddled and protected.

You set yourself up for the question, now answer it.

So, if NHMS is not a current site sponsor, are you looking at NHMS as a potential site sponsor?

Continuing to refuse to answer can be just as damning.




What's NHIS? I've said it before and I'll say it again, the reason for most of all the negativity is people who live in the past and can't accept what reality is today. I remember when I could go to the mall and buy new sneakers for $12. Can't do that today, but that doesn't mean I stopped wearing shoes out of protest. Doesn't mean I go to the mall and complain to everybody the moment I walk in about how bad it is today trying to buy a pair of sneakers. No, because the reality is, it's a different world than 25 years ago and I can accept that.

You call it NHIS. Live in the past much?

And no, they're not an advertiser on the site. I actually just put up some boxes for their events because I'm going to be covering them. Haven't taken a dime from them.

[ShawnCourchesne]

Sure, I hope NHMS decides to advertise on my site, in the same way that NHMS advertised with the Hartford Courant for years while I worked there. When I worked at the Hartford Courant, having NHMS as an advertising partner never changed in any way how they were treated in any editorial sense and the same thing stands true with where I work now.

I wrote negative stories and positive stories about the track and my opinion or how the story was written was never shaped by any advertising relationship. While I worked at the Hartford Courant, Stafford Speedway, Thompson Speedway, the Waterford Speedbowl and Lime Rock Park all advertised on the pages of the Courant and it never changed how I treated those tracks in stories, positively or negatively. Go ask the those in charge at Stafford, Waterford, Thompson or Lime Rock if they thought I treated them positively because they were an advertiser with the publication that I worked for? Over the years I wrote negative stories at some time or another about each of those facilities, stories that I know the management at those facilities didn't like seeing in print. It's called being objective. I'm a professional journalist and I've been a professional journalist for nearly 20 years. I don't play favorites based on advertising practices or for any other reason. If you like to think that I do, there's nothing I can do to change your opinion. I stated my opinion in a column about the situation at NHMS, backed up with rational arguments why I think that opinion to be true. If you don't agree with that opinion, I'm fine with that.

Acadia, I'll respect the wishes of Richie and Howie here and stop beating the dead horse. I came on here and asked you a very simple question (well before you asked me to respond to any inquiry). I just answered the question you asked. Unfortunately you don't have the same courage to answer the question I asked you because it would expose you as a liar. You stated, as fact, that the winning team at NHMS will lose money. You said that in a post here. I asked that you show the evidence of that by producing an actual itemized budget for a team, not just by saying what you heard from your second cousin's uncle's friend who worked for a Modified Tour team nine years ago. I know you can't produce it because I know you don't have that and don't have any access to that. Like I said, I have the courage to come on here, with a real name, a real identity AND respond to someone when they inquire about something with me. I don't hide, I don't cower in fear that people might find out who I am. Why are you so spineless?

[catfish]

Thanks Richie and Howie. I agree completely and basically the same thing I was trying to say about Jason on another post.

[rim runner]

To support this times have changed argument, have the purses for any other division (Cup, Nationwide, K&N) at NHMS been cut recently too?

If so, then maybe that point has some merit, but if the modifieds are the only ones taking a pay cut, then it really doesn't hold water.

I also don't understand how an organization expects to effectively runs a series from 1500 miles way from the series base of most teams and tracks? Especially when there is very little short track & division knowledge in that FL office.

I don't think many people will dispute that the communcation between teams and NASCAR isn't what it could be if they had the tour office and series decision makers located in New England.

[ShawnCourchesne]

NASCAR cut purses overall in its three national divisions (Sprint Cup, Nationwide Series and Camping World Trucks) 10 percent in 2010. NASCAR then additionally cut the purses in the Nationwide Series by 20 percent last year.

NASCAR Will Cut Nationwide Series Purses By 20% Next Season (http://www.sportsbusinessdaily.com/Daily/Issues/2010/08/Issue-236/Leagues-Governing-Bodies/NASCAR-Will-Cut-Nationwide-Series-Purses-By-20-Next-Season.aspx)

[Acadia]

Because one series has purse cuts does not mean all should have purse cuts. Each should have an independent assessment as to what each series can afford, if any.

Look, the Cup teams aren’t in bad times, they have fleets of personal and corporate aircraft, helicopters and such. There is profound opulence that is carefully kept out of the public eye as much as possible. Cup drivers fund multimillion dollar charitable foundations. It is silly when these people claim financial hardship. So comparing purse cuts at the Cup, NW and truck levels, those that have major TV and sponsorship deals, is not quite comparable to the mod series which is a money losing hobby. It's those TV and sponsorship deals that have kept the NW and trucks alive all these years with no fans in the stands. Purse cuts for the modifieds means more losses for the mod owners. How can anyone possibly substantiate purse cuts for the mods because of purse cuts in another mega-million dollar series? The mods are a completely different product and market.

How many career modified drivers have accumulated multimillion dollar wealth exclusively due to their purse earnings as a modified driver on the Mod Tour? Add up all those first place winnings over the years and see what it adds up to. LOL

Then make a list for the career modified drivers that were actually paid to drive and what they were paid, and then make another list for drivers that pay for the ride, and a list of drivers that are not paid and do not pay to drive.

[Gil]

You gotta admit that the NHIS name had class versus cookie cutter name of NHMS! Kind of like Porsche vs VW....

:lol::lol::lol:

[ShawnCourchesne]

Acadia, I answered your question, now can you come through too? Oh no, you can't, you totally ignored it. It shows the validity of anything you say has ZERO merit when you make a statement like that but then don't have ANYTHING to back it up. Come on Acadia, you made a request of me and I responded. How about you do the same, back up your words with some legit facts? Oh wait, what am I thinking? You backing up words with that fact is like you showing courage, not something that happens here. Good job Acadia, change the subject like you always do when someone asks you to back up something you said with fact. Hmmm, wonder what you'll change the subject to after this comment? I know you won't respond to it.

[Sicklajoie]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=azLGYPid_bA

[scott]

THANK YOU Sicklajoie!! That hit the nail right on the head!

[ShawnCourchesne]

Acadia, I feel so bad for people like Richie, Howie, Denise and Polly and so many others who have over the years helped to always have a place where Modified fans and teams could come together and have hearty conversation and debate about the racing series they all love. I was here when Lou started all this, he must be rolling in his grave seeing an arsonist like you come in and destroy what has long been a place so many people appreciated. Yeah, you're an arsonist, someone who comes here and pours gasoline on your own created fires just for your personal pleasure. You use fantasy world information to spread lies and then when rational people come here to refute those lies with actual facts you insult them personally because you have no other recourse. You're an anonymous, spineless, ignorant soil grub who has absolutely trashed what was once a great message board for those involved with the Whelen Modified Tour. Just pathetic.*I've said what I have to say, I'm done here, I can't be a part of this any longer, it's just become absolutely ridiculous.

[uticamike]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=azLGYPid_bA

Thanks Joe. Shawn is a girls name isn't it? I can't tell who's who in the vid. LOL


"You're an anonymous, spineless, ignorant soil grub who has absolutely trashed what was once a great message board for those involved with the Whelen Modified Tour. Just pathetic.*I've said what I have to say, I'm done here, I can't be a part of this any longer, it's just become absolutely ridiculous."


So much for civility!! :(

[RGeeProductions]

Shawn is a girls name isn't it?

Really???
Well with that, this thread is done.
Seems there are many who just can't be mature enough to have decent debates about things and must pick on each other.
I already gave a warning earlier and that's it!
If any of this stuff starts anywhere in the forum again, threads will be shut down or deleted!